There were a lot of hognose snakes. This market is getting saturated, especially online:

Garters are getting popular. This was a third of the table of one of a few garter breeders in attendance, who I had a nice conversation with:

This was the prettiest snake I saw -- Jungle Ocelot retic:

Couple of expensive ones. Boelen's python:

And a ball python that looks like it doesn't know that it is worth about as much as a fairly nice new car:

The ball python market is -- still -- weird:

Speaking of high prices, I thought this was getting a bit crazy:

Something sort of price-related, but troubling in a different way:

 

Continuing the price commentary, many less common species were priced even higher than online. The Coleonyx variegatus (on the left; I didn't realize I caught a wild yawn from that guy) are about $75 each online, and I get $200-$225 for a viper gecko pair online, less at expos:

Somehow leachianus are still really pricey:

These are priced a bit too high, too, but it is nice to see CB box turtles:

More turtles. At least they're only selling to bona fide educational and scientific buyers...

This was the least cool animal I saw, possibly ever:

Not all sketchy things are smuggled animals. I talked to a (very friendly and nice) rep from Chewy -- formerly owned by PetSmart, now a public stock corp with $11 billion with a B in annual sales -- who explained this sign to me:

Turns out Snake Discovery is licensing their name to be used on Chewy branded products (I was shown a PVC enclosure with both logos on it as an example). It was explained to me that both brands would be working together to maximize their influence in the market, or something to that effect.

 

This was the least cool animal I saw, possibly ever:

Could you expand on this ? I think I'm missing something.

Always like to see what your expos look like over there.

 

OK, I'm going to end on a positive note. I talked to a nice guy from the UK (no, really -- that's not sarcasm ) who was with an organization pushing for the sort of quality care that the UK is actually pretty well known for pushing (again, I mean this in a generally positive way, sincerely):

It is neat to see this positive aspect of the hobby, even if he and I did disagree on some of the details.

I had heard of this organization before on Amphibicast:

The Healthy Trade Institute is a certification program for herp importers and breeders that helps with pathogen testing and biosecurity consulting. They're not too far past the initial development stages, I think, but once they get all their ducks in a row I think this will be a pretty useful organisation. I had a really nice conversation with Dr. Danielle Galvin (behind the table), and she gave me a positive impression of what they're doing.

About – Healthy Trade Institute

healthytrade.org

To end on something really neat, this is a 5 week old African porcupine that I was allowed to pet, and though it was not explicitly for sale it was the most excellent critter at the expo (except maybe for two mini dachshunds in a baby stroller that I missed getting a photo of):

Anyway, hope you enjoyed the photos, and feel free to comment. I will say that I had even more fun than I usually do at this event, and I think it is because I spent time talking to people (many I didn't mention here) and bought exactly nothing.

 

The couple regular dart vendors were in attendance. Josh's:

For one of the biggest frog vendors (and probably one of the largest herp specialty companies in the US), you'd think JF would have a bit more sophisticated setup than bird-netting over their cups like a fly-by-night animal flipper.

I think these are very pretty:

T. marmoratus are really cool, but a lot of people fail with them because they try to keep them aquatic year-round when marms really only want to be in the water for a couple months during breeding season.

And a ball python that looks like it doesn't know that it is worth about as much as a fairly nice new car:

Asking price and what something actually sells for can be wildly different...

The ball python market is -- still -- weird:

A lot of BP breeders are still in denial that the gravy days of ball pythons are behind them. Not that BPs are going to become worthless, or that people will stop keeping/buying them, but the morph pyramid scheme has broken down. We've seen this exact thing happen with corn snakes, with guppies, swordtails and platies in aquatics, etc. Eventually the rate of new traits slows to a trickle, and the market shifts from trying to produce "world's first" combinations towards establishing lines and trying to produce the "best" or most attractive version of a particular trait. That shift means the market stabilizes, but also nobody's going to pay $10,000 for an animal.

It seems like the market is going to stabilize at "Pet grade" BPs being a $20-$150 animal, "breeder grade" are $200-$500 and "high end" BPs probably will max out around $1000. BPs are not expensive to produce, a baby sold at $50 should still turn a modest profit for most breeders, but there's not going to be the 1000%+ margin that drew in many breeders who were only ever in it for the money.

There were a lot of hognose snakes. This market is getting saturated, especially online:

We can (at least partially) thank Snake Discovery for that, and BP breeders jumping ship over to hogs thinking they can recreate the speculative market in a new species.

Something sort of price-related, but troubling in a different way:

Leaving aside the ethical concerns, from a purely financial perspective a mystery box is always going to be a poor value for the buyer. If the seller thought they could move those animals for $125 they'd just have them out on display on the table. I could see a mystery box being tempting if it's priced the same or less as the cheapest animals on the table (essentially being a gimmick to move pet-grade animals), but $125 is well above the going rate for a basic crested at this point.

Continuing the price commentary, many less common species were priced even higher than online. The Coleonyx variegatus (on the left; I didn't realize I caught a wild yawn from that guy) are about $75 each online, and I get $200-$225 for a viper gecko pair online, less at expos:

I've been hearing that there's a lot more interest in small geckos lately, especially micro- sized species like Vipers. Apparently the trend is putting together desktop-sized "bioactive" enclosures for them, kind of like the "nano tank" fad in fishkeeping (with all of the potential pitfall that entails).

Somehow leachianus are still really pricey:

That price seems high, but I can at least understand why leachies command a premium: slow growing, slow rate of reproduction, you can't just pair a male and female together and expect them to be compatible (they're apparently notorious for maiming or outright killing each other).

More turtles. At least they're only selling to bona fide educational and scientific buyers...

Doesn't seem like it applies in this case (vendor looks like a flipper), but the 4" rule for turtles only applies to businesses; there's an exemption written into the law that allows individuals to sell baby turtles:

Exceptions. The provisions of this section are not applicable to:

1. The sale, holding for sale, and distribution of live turtles and viable turtle eggs for bona fide scientific, educational, or exhibitional purposes, other than use as pets.
2. The sale, holding for sale, and distribution of live turtles and viable turtle eggs not in connection with a business

Turns out Snake Discovery is licensing their name to be used on Chewy branded products (I was shown a PVC enclosure with both logos on it as an example). It was explained to me that both brands would be working together to maximize their influence in the market, or something to that effect.

"Sell out" is a tired, often misused cliche, but it sure fits Snake Discovery these days...

I was informed that this particular animal "came from a zoo in Louisiana". First, I very much doubt that's true; that claim is all too common and the zoo is never identified by name -- it is a 'I don't know whose drugs those are, officer, they must have fallen into my grocery bag' story. But if it is true -- or even believed by people -- it is arguably worse than smuggling. If zoo-permitted animals enter (or are thought to enter) the trade through a herp flipper and thus lend some possible credibility to the species in captivity generally, that goes a long way toward helping launderers make their trafficked animals seem clean.

Someone who has shinglebacks with legal provenance has no need to bring them to a show, people will be literally knocking on your door to buy them. I imagine they would also probably put a little more effort into their display than a Petco 10 gallon sliding top "terrarium" with hardware store mulch...

As for the laundering of smuggled animals, it's really egregious in the turtle community. When smuggled turtles get intercepted by USFWS they are often given to a certain non-profit conservation organization for "safekeeping." This organization then hands off the animals to certain members (who are just private individuals) since they "don't have enough space" at the non-profit facility. Funnily enough, those smuggled animals often start breeding...

While these captive conservation organizations do legitimate work, they're also definitely being used as a shield for wealthy and well connected people to obtain protected animals and generate a paper trail that obscures their illegal origin. You don't have to dig very deep to see that there's a lot of sketchy stuff going on, including assocations with known smugglers.

 

That jungle ocelot retic is absolutely gorgeous!