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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Does anyone have any experience keeping thumbnails with carnivorous plants such as Sundews (Drosera sp.) or Pitcher Plants (Nepenthes)? There are quite a few threads on here regarding them, but curious if anyone is actively keeping them with Thumbnails?

I've seen a few examples, but have never tried it. I keep Drosera capenthis outside of my tanks now (and they help to clean up a few stray flies!).

My thoughts on Drosera sp. is that it may actually be able to catch and consume small froglets. Full grown Ranitomeya would not have an issue I don't think.

Pitcher Plants seem like they would be pretty harmless, as the frogs should be able to climb out. I assume they may actually hide in them. I have zero experience keeping any Pitch Plants though.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Hi, zero experience keeping both as I'm still waiting for my pdf 馃槄.
But I've kept a few carnivorous plants and Pinguicula would be harmless, Drosera, frankly, I can't see it catching more than a FF.
When it comes to Nepenthes, according to below, it would be fine ?
Do pitcher plants eat frogs? - YouTube
I think a lot of the threads I have read say they should be fine...but nobody seems to keep them together, so I don't really want to be the one who experiments with it!
 

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I think a lot of the threads I have read say they should be fine...but nobody seems to keep them together, so I don't really want to be the one who experiments with it!
I can completely understand that 馃槃. I researched Nepenthes and Frogs after seeing your question but my initial reaction was "no way, it could drown in it and then be digested". But maybe it's just a misconception... Pinguicula, Utricularia and Drosera would be fine, provided the terrarium's conditions are ok for them.
 

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Unfortunately I can鈥檛 comment on their suitability with frogs, since I have a Nepenthes that is quite happy in my paludarium but no frogs. However I can say that Droseras won鈥檛 go well with dart frogs just due to misting and humidity: Droseras can鈥檛 stand being misted and really don鈥檛 want moisture sitting on their leaves - I have killed enough in the past year that I鈥檝e given up on that genus. They prefer to be watered from the bottom up only. Pinguiculas are ok with being misted as long as they have good light and good airflow.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Unfortunately I can鈥檛 comment on their suitability with frogs, since I have a Nepenthes that is quite happy in my paludarium but no frogs. However I can say that Droseras won鈥檛 go well with dart frogs just due to misting and humidity: Droseras can鈥檛 stand being misted and really don鈥檛 want moisture sitting on their leaves - I have killed enough in the past year that I鈥檝e given up on that genus. They prefer to be watered from the bottom up only. Pinguiculas are ok with being misted as long as they have good light and good airflow.
I've found the Drosera very sensitive to light as well...low light is not something they tolerate at all.
 

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While I haven't kept them together, I do know people have done so successfully. While the odds of a frog dying in a pitcher plant are very low, it's not 0%. After all, they can drown in something as simple as a bromeliad.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
While I haven't kept them together, I do know people have done so successfully. While the odds of a frog dying in a pitcher plant are very low, it's not 0%. After all, they can drown in something as simple as a bromeliad.
I've never had a frog/froglet drown in a bromeliad. It should also be noted that Nepenthes do have a waxy coating on the inside of the pitcher to make climbing out difficult - albeit this is designed to trap insects, not frogs.

I would suspect any frogs drowning in bromeliads likely had some other issues, but as you suggest, certainly not impossible.
 

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Heliamphora occur in the same habitat as Dendrobates leucamelas so you could try one of those although I have found them very difficult.
 

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There鈥檚 a species of dart frog that exists in high elevation, sun-drenched bogs? Cool!
I'm not sure if they are permanently found there but they have been reported on tepuis. I find it a little hard to believe but Minyobates steyermarki is endemic to a tepui so who knows.
 

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I hear the gears turning. You have an extra terrarium around, I hope. ;)
Well, I have been wanting to grow Heliamphora for years, and I think it would do well in a setup along with Droseras...but I would have to be convinced that the frogs have a preference for the environment, not just have been observed there once or twice or occasionally venture there, before adding frogs to that. Tepuis are a very unique, stressful environment for anything not acclimated to them.

In any case, I just set up a small Exo Terra for mounted mini orchids (overflow from my paludarium) and now I'm right in the middle of a mixed genus jewel orchid/begonia vase plan, so no, no extra terrariums around. :D

I actually have no intention of keeping frogs any time soon, keeping bug cultures around to feed them just seems off-putting, but darts + carnivorous plants is a fascinating subject. For instance, I know that some epiphytic species of Utricularia grow out of the water trapped by Bromeliad axils, and I would love to try one of those some time. Are they from the same habitat as dart frogs? Would their little traps be big enough to capture just-hatched froglets swimming around?
 

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Possibly relevant:

"Bladderworts are only big enough to eat small animals such as: paramecium, amoeba, water fleas, aquatic worms and mosquito larvae. Larger animals such as newborn tadpoles and fish are sometimes found hanging half out of bladders. The sac digests whatever it can hold, but is not big enough to ingest an entire
creature this large."

 
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Possibly relevant:

"Bladderworts are only big enough to eat small animals such as: paramecium, amoeba, water fleas, aquatic worms and mosquito larvae. Larger animals such as newborn tadpoles and fish are sometimes found hanging half out of bladders. The sac digests whatever it can hold, but is not big enough to ingest an entire
creature this large."

Right, tadpole, that seems like the word I was looking for. My Utricularia graminifolia bladders are about 1/8" - how big are newly hatched tadpoles?
 

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Drosera and frogs would be a nightmare in my opinion....mucilage and active moving larger animals a no go.

Nepenthes I am not for sure about. Many insects and animals make use of various Nepenthes. That said I would think there could be some concern. Is the waxy upper region going to be problematic to gain foothold for the frogs? If it slides into the lower portions will it stimulate the plant and changes in pH cause issues. Some Nepenthes reach below a pH of 4. Amphibians and reptiles are found at times to be consumed but not for sure the frequency or diseases animal etc..

Now many that have kept bog gardens outside will find various tree frogs make Sarracenia a nice spot to shade themselves and pick up an easy snack. I have had Eastern Grays in my little "bog" out on a patio table in a few different Sarrencenia, with one being S. purpurea. S. purpurea has also however been found to "consume" salamanders.

I don't think I would add carnivorous plants in with frogs.
 

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For instance, I know that some epiphytic species of Utricularia grow out of the water trapped by Bromeliad axils, and I would love to try one of those some time. Are they from the same habitat as dart frogs?
Utricularia longiflolia is the one that grows in broms, an absolutely fascinating example of evolution. Utricularia jamesoniana grows epiphytically in central and South America where dart frogs are found although this is one that's notoriously hard to grow. It is hard to find although I know of someone on instagram who has some from time to time.
Also not sure if I can link this here but whatever it's a cool video.
 

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Right, tadpole, that seems like the word I was looking for. My Utricularia graminifolia bladders are about 1/8" - how big are newly hatched tadpoles?
I'm guessing a bit because I can't fit a ruler into a brom -- about 1/3" snout-tail, for thumbnails.
 

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Schledog, I'm pretty sure U. longifolia is a terrestrial. But either way, I think it is a good viv candidate given space and moisture.

I have U. graminifolia and U. humbolti x alpina in a viv. U. graminifolia is pretty adaptable for me, growing everywhere from submerged to epiphyticaly. Ping's do well in the viv for me too.

As a note, I think you don't really see Nepenthese in vivs much because of mature size. I only have a couple in my greenhouse, but the smallest is maybe 5 years old and is multiple 1.5 meter vines. The largest is closer to 10 years old and a solid 2 meters in diameter, and more stems than I can count. Both only produce pitchers less than 10 cm in size; ie the kind one might be tempted put in a viv as a small seedling or cutting.

I had Brocchinia reducta in a viv for awhile as well. It did well but never looked right; too tall and skinny.
 

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I believe the species that grow in bromeliad axils in the wild are humboldtii and nelumbifolia. Apparently, they actually grow in Brocchinia sometimes, but in any case they seem to use larger broms than I have room for at the moment. However, someone said humboldtii grows on tepuis, so I鈥檓 envisioning a very cool tepui-biotype plant only tank...

I currently have a Nepenthes ampullaria x (spectabilis x talangensis) that I have had in my tank for a year and hasn鈥檛 outgrown it yet. The pitchers seem to stay about 4鈥 and perhaps if I let it the vine would get a meter long, or the ampullaria influence might limit the vining, I鈥檒l see over the next few years. Worst case, I鈥檒l take tip cuttings and propagate.
 
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