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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I'm considering getting some tincs for a project. And I have some questions that I had a hard time finding anything about online. I really want to know my stuff before I get myself anything.
1. In a large enclosure can a group of frogs be kept together even if you have multiple females? Females of this species can wrestle and stress each other. But will enough space allow them to cohabitate?

2. Can different color morphs of the same species be kept together? Ik you shouldn't mix species of dart frog together. But I've heard the same of morphs and am confused. If I can't, why?

3. If I provide covered, small ponds could the frogs breed on there own and be healthy? I kinda want to try my hand at it but also don't care too much to make a profit or hand rear. Mostly just want to recreate habitat as much as possible and keep things happy, healthy and natural.
 

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Check out the sticky in this section (Beginner Discussion) it will answer these and more questions. Popular and Helpful 'Beginner Discussion' Threads

The Beginner Frog FAQ! Beginner Frog FAQ!
specifically has quick answers for your questions 1 and 2, but searching key terms of your questions will provide you all the information you could want about those questions as they have been heavily discussed.

For question 3 water features do not really provide any value for darts and really just add risk. Searching "water feature" will give you lots of threads to read on this. Here are 2 quick ones to get started. What's with the water features??

As far as whether a water feature could be used for breeding and would result in healthy tads. Too many variables there for anyone to be able to say. Take a look at the tadpole care sheets to get an idea of what that would entail. Once your further along in your researching and have a more concrete idea of what frog specifically you want to keep and how your tank is going to be setup you will either have answered that question yourself, or will be able to provide all of the necessary information about your setup for others here to give you advice.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Ok, for question 1, I'm getting the consensus of kinda. You still have to have more males (3-1), and really watch the females. Possible, but is a case by case basis, generally to be avoided. I thought this was the case but I'm here for other opinions of those who know more than me.

For question 2, it's a no for the reason that they are subspecies. So despite that say a cobalt tinc, and yellow back tinc are the same species, they are different locals. So mixing isn't the best. I’m really glad I got this clarification as I’m used to snake morphs meaning just a different color.

Question 3 I feel needs more clarification. I’m not talking a water feature so much as something akin to a deeper petri dish, no more than 2.5 inches deep. Kind of like the cup method of raising tadpoles but inside the tank. Letting nature do its thing. I’ve never heard of anyone doing this before and am more curious than anything.

I also now would like clarification on something else. Tincs as far as I know are about 2.5 inches. I believe I’ve seen them at this size and other places size them at this too. But here they’re placed at 1.5. I’m assuming this is a morph/locality thing but I’d like to know more.
 

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For question 2, it's a no for the reason that they are subspecies. So despite that say a cobalt tinc, and yellow back tinc are the same species, they are different locals. So mixing isn't the best. I’m really glad I got this clarification as I’m used to snake morphs meaning just a different color.
All correct -- though I'd say something WAY stronger than "isn't the best" -- except that there aren't any dart 'subspecies' (well, and that all snake morphs aren't simply a different color, but that's another thread on a different forum). That's an official taxonomic designation that simply isn't currently used for any darts AFAIK. The morphs are locale-specific, though, and that's the important message.

'The cup method' inside the viv would involve you feeding the tads, not "letting nature do its thing". The tads need to be fed by the keeper wherever the tad cup is placed. Ideally it would be outside the viv, since inside the viv needs all the room there is for the frogs. Note that if you raise tads you'll need additional vivs to grow them out.

Tinc locales vary in size a lot -- from 1.5 to probably over 3 inches.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I used sub species for my own understanding but yeah! My question is then how would tincs grow up on there own. even if it isn't something I could replicate now, I'd love to think of way to replicate that later.
Also are any of the locals/morphs typically lager? I'm looking for something 2.5-3 inches. worried about space on anything larger. but a little scared to have anything smaller. Having a hard time finding anything on this here or anywhere else.
 

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My question is then how would tincs grow up on there own.
They won't on their own in captivity. There simply is not enough space in your, or any of our, tank for Dendrobates tinctorius to reproduce and have the tadpoles raise themselves in the tank. To do this you would need a MASSIVE ecosystem, measured in the thousands of gallons in volume and an abundant water section to support the growth of the tadpoles.

For reference I keep my Ameerega species, which are smaller than most tinctorius, in 36x18x24" tanks which are about 66 gallons and I carefully hardscape the tanks to provide extra usable space, and don't waste any of it on a water feature.
 

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Also are any of the locals/morphs typically lager? I'm looking for something 2.5-3 inches. worried about space on anything larger. but a little scared to have anything smaller. Having a hard time finding anything on this here or anywhere else.
The smaller morphs aren't less hardy, so there is no worry on that.

Searching 'biggest tinc' here gives lots of hits.
 
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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
The smaller morphs aren't less hardy, so there is no worry on that.
I have some vision issues and am more worried about crushing or not seeing rather than hardiness in this specific case. Plus I just like that size. Eye catching and easy to see. Rn I’m looking at giant cobalts, powder blues, and patricias. I just find it hard to see anything specific as everywhere you can buy them seems to copy paste everything. And places like this just say “big”. But I also understand it’s not hard and fast and rearing has stuff to do with it too. I kinda just feel like I’m guesstimating at this point.
 

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I just find it hard to see anything specific as everywhere you can buy them seems to copy paste everything.
You've just stumbled into the circle of wisdom. Not just about dart frogs, either, and not just about the internet. :cool:

Searching 'tinctorius' here should have gotten you to the care sheet for tincs. In that care sheet is this gem of a link, which is distinctly not an Amazon Affiliate site and is about as trustworthy as one might hope for as far as general morph overviews go.

I'm not a tinc guy, but I'd suggest that the viv size you're considering (a fish tank? best research 'ventilation' until your head hurts) if well-designed would be appropriate in size for a 1.1 pair of the larger morphs.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Between my snake, lizards, and plethora of fish I've ran into this time and time again, more annoying than anything to me. But thank you! That link was exactly what I was looking for. Never really on forums so this is sorta new to me. It's looking like normal cobalts should be about the right size for me. As for the tank, it's not a fish tank And with my lizards I've looked into ventilation and am looking into a portable hydrometer/thermometer for all my critters. Not my first rodeo. But before I do anything with this stuff I wanna make sure I got everything straight.
 

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Well what would you recommend then?
I don't measure the humidity. It's often misleading.

The reason we aren't suggesting a brand of hygrometer is that chasing a humidity value on a gauge isn't necessarily helpful for the frogs, and often can be detrimental to their health.

For example:

You can chase a humidity value, have the air humidity level be exactly right but have little to no moisture at the substrate / leaf litter level and have the frogs not have enough usable moisture near where they want to stay.

Alternatively, you can have a perfect air humidity level and completely sopping wet substrate and leaf litter which can lead to health issues such as foot rot for the frogs.
 

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Here's a post (post #7 in the thread linked below) that illustrates why hygrometers are pretty much useless. Tank is quite dry, try the hygrometer reads 99% humidity.

 

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Some reptiles can be cared for better if the keeper measures RH (for many, overall RH doesn't matter so long as it is >30% and <80, and given that most human houses have relatively stable or at least easily estimated RH it isn't worth measuring). Many reptiles are fairly dependent on RH (and oral water intake) to maintain good skin condition and shedding. These species should not be forced to spend all their time in their moist hide, or hiding in some moist area of their viv, since at the very least they (many of these species, anyway) need to thermoregulate rather than chase moisture. So for these species the ambient viv RH needs to be at an appropriate level. These species should have their RH measured.

Darts are less dependent on ambient viv RH (I realize this sounds crazy, but it isn't). A properly set up dart viv has many, many spots that are always at very high RH (within plants, under leaf litter) regardless of what the RH is at some arbitrary location that happens to be a good surface to stick a suction cup probe. Further, the frogs know where these spots are and when they need to, they go there (pro tip: that's one way to gauge moisture in the viv -- ask the frogs). Darts are very dependent on damp substrate and other areas to drink from (they drink through a patch of skin on their belly); chasing RH sometimes (often) leads keepers to try to alter RH by changing misting schedules which leads to very dry surfaces and a "good" RH.

We import -- consciously or unconsciously -- husbandry approaches from other taxa such as reptiles or fish into dart keeping. While lumping together non-avain reptiles and amphibians ('herptiles') on the basis of their general lifestyles ('herpein' is Greek for 'to crawl') makes some sense, evolutionarily they're pretty distinct, and so have a lot of different requirements (for the purposes of this subject, the differences in skin functions call for different husbandry considerations).

Maintaining:
  • some sort of sensible misting schedule (a couple times a day, not too close to lights-out time, and long enough that the substrate gets soaked and salts flushed into the drainage layer), and
  • a decent amount of ventilation (which depends on air circulation and RH in the room, water holding capacity of surfaces in the viv, probably viv footprint relative to height, position of low vents, temp differential between viv and room, etc) judged by how fast the surfaces in the viv dry out after a thorough rain,
  • in a decently designed viv that includes
    • a good amount of hardscape made of natural (semi porous) materials,
    • a good amount of plant mass somewhat evenly distributed throughout the viv (not all right under the top screen, and not all on the substrate)
    • a decent (=thick) layer of leaf litter
    • a well draining substrate (ABG, gravel, calcium clay, turface, foam)
    • a non-wicking drainage layer
...will yield a viv with the proper amount of moisture for darts. Measuring RH doesn't change the need for all these elements in the list.
 
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