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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
While I am a noob to the dart frog community, I have been keeping and breeding, many reptile species for 20 years. I have sold countless animals to people and have always tried my best to be fair with those who have contacted me to buy animals in the order they contacted me.

My question is what is fair? Who gets the animal being offered for sale? The first guy that contacts you interested in purchasing or the fifth guy in line that posts "I got cash and I'll buy it now" in the ad. In my case I have to send a PM because I don't have the minimum 25 post to in an ad to say I want it. I know that I am one of the first, if not the first to make contact because I am always on here and often catch ads and am the first to view. Sorry for the rant...
 

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I'm afraid that you will find in the frogging world, that it is not always first come, first serve. Anyone who has been in the hobby any amount of time, has lost frogs in shipping. Therefore, somebody local, or someone willing to pick up frogs, can generally cut right to the front of the line. It is pretty well known that locals will almost always get first shot.
Is this fair? Fair to who? Fair to the buyer? Maybe not. Fair to the seller? Yes. Fair to the frogs who have a better chance of survival? Definitely.
You are also going to see that friends and acquaintances are going to get a trip up to the front of the line. An experienced frogger will be given priorities over somebody new, particularly with rarer frogs.
You may also see that somebody offering a hard to get frog in trade, may get priority.
This is probably not what you had hoped to hear, but I have seen it many, many times. The breeder works hard, and gets to do what he wants with his/her frogs. This is probably not a popular answer for purchasers/hobbyists to hear, but it is stone cold reality.
Generally, unless you are looking for something very rare, your time will come soon enough. It is nothing to have to wait a few months or 6 months to get the frogs you are looking for. Hang in there and your time will come! Good Luck in your quest!
 

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I think it depends on the circumstances. Will I sell to someone local over having to ship? Absolutely, and likely for less. Will I sell to someone that I know over someone that I don't? You betcha. Does that make me unfair? Nope. I think it has to do much with one's approach, or dare I say philosophy, toward the hobby. Having worked with a species, raised up offspring, my preference is always for them to end up in capable hands. Any profit is really just a means to keep my collection going. As a result, I'm less inclined to sell to the first person that makes an offer. That said, if someone I don't know were to pm me and tell me how much they were interested in a species, and demonstrate some level of well intent, interest, etc, I would of course be inclined to sell to them.

Anyway, good luck, and don't worry...more than enough frogs to go around...a few times.
 

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That's rough.. I know the feeling.. been there.. but get your posts up there past 25 ask questions, respond to threads and once past 25 you can get your post in. This still may not guarantee you the frog. Some breeders feel because you only have 10 posts, your inexperienced. A few years ago, someone offered standard lamasi for sale to an experienced frogger, I was first on line and because I only had near 100 posts, they thought I did not have the experience to handle these frogs. They were sold to someone else who had several hundred posts. This irked me and because I have been too busy feeding, caring for my large collection of frogs and couldn't find the time to post on here every day that someone would think of me as inexperienced. Once I got their age and explained to them that I was keeping frogs successfully for more years than they were born, they wanted to add me to a 'wait list'. I don't feel I'm more priveledged than anyone else to have a particular frog, but this is the mindset of some of these breeders. I can understand and appreciate that they want a frog to go to an experienced frogger, but if that is their reasoning to exclude me or anyone else, at least get to know me. A few months later I got my lamasi, not from them, but from someone I knew. Like Pumilio said, it's up to the breeder who he releases his frogs to for whatever reasons he/she has. There are so many breeders on here, I'm sure you will find what you are looking for. It's best to steer yourself clear of anyone selling frogs for purely cash.. True caring breeders are the ones who care about their frogs and those are the breeders/hobbyists you want to deal with.

Good Luck with your search,
Peter Keane
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
No real biggie. It's just been something on my mind for a while and figured I'd ask here....to try to get up the 25 posts. It seems that on most online classifieds when one can post in the ad people are quick to negotiate with five people at once. I agree with the local sales to repeat or known buyers. The stress they go through being shipped or losing an animal in shipping sucks. I recently had a blue line green tree python arrive frozen solid.

This is a great place to lean new ideas. Could be the reason my post count is low. Too busy using the search function.
 

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I usually just pm the seller and let them decide on however they decide to do it... Personally I usually don't see the need to add a post to the seller's ad.. just to say I sent a pm...

Ed
 

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Hey Art, Another thing you can do when you bump your posts up is to just post a want ad. Plenty of breeders that might not be in any real hurry to post something. They may just be waiting for the next show, but might see your ad and pm you.
 

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For the record - there were some inconsistencies on that ad and it has been pulled.

If you were looking at it - keep your money in your pocket (or your account).

Just remember people - if it seems too good to be true ... yep, it IS too good to be true.

s
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
It really wasn't that ad that began my thoughts on the subject. It just caught me on a day when I had a rough commute to work. I am still building tanks so I have plenty of time.

For the record - there were some inconsistencies on that ad and it has been pulled.

If you were looking at it - keep your money in your pocket (or your account).

Just remember people - if it seems too good to be true ... yep, it IS too good to be true.

s
 

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For the most part I try and be pretty fair. If I have a frog for sale, all things being equal I'll sell to the first person to ask me about it. That being said, things are rarely equal.

If you're local, you get bumped up. If I've had good transactions with you before, you get bumped up. If I know you're really experienced in comparison to the other froggers asking, you may get bumped up. If I happen to know of a particularly dire circumstance you're in, you may get bumped up (this happened recently with a local and one of his Veradero imitators). If I happen to know that you're working with a frog that I really want, you get bumped to the _very_ front of the line in hopes that you'll do the same for me (doesn't always happen, would be nice if it did).

While the above qualifications may not be considered "fair," I _do_ think they are to be expected....
 

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Fair doesn't always mean equal it means equitable.

I usually just pm the seller and let them decide on however they decide to do it... Personally I usually don't see the need to add a post to the seller's ad.. just to say I sent a pm...

Ed
Yes and not to get all Mod but in the UA for Classifieds #6 says:

Replies to ads are only allowed for questions and answers concerning the products in the ad, and requests for additional information. All other comments will be removed.
To me, all those leg lifting, territory marking posts violate #6. However, there are just too many to remove them all.
 

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Hi Art,

You just gave yorself the best advice possible, "I have plenty of time". There are many froggers who want what they want when they want it and don't necessarily think what is best for the frogs. Not shipping when it's too hot or too cold is very important, though some people become impatient. Some people want to start-out with frogs that are very rare or hard to care for, instead of working with species that are more forgiving first.

I like to say I have nothing but time when it comes to my frogging. I'm not in a rush for anything.

Take care and good luck in the hobby, Richard.

It really wasn't that ad that began my thoughts on the subject. It just caught me on a day when I had a rough commute to work. I am still building tanks so I have plenty of time.
 
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