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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Hello everyone :D

I'm not sure where to put an intro but i'll post a brief one here. My name is dustin, and i'm 17 (as of a few days ago 27). I'm interested in just about everything, Currently i'm studying 3 additional languages, i grow carnivorous plants, soon hope to start guitar, can cook, not sure what else, if you want to friend me i'm on fb and we can chat haha. i think the links on my profile page here.

Anyway, i was interested in Poison dart frogs years ago but before that i was heavily into growing carnivorous plants. now that my cp collection has been taken down except for a few plants i have some room. After some research i rediscovered PDFs and now i'm really would like to get started.

Here's a summary of what i've read so far...

For the tank set up:
1. Vivariums require a 2-3" drainage layer created by the eggcrate/gravel or LECA (hydroponic clay beads, rinsed). Once you have it down cover it with a fine screen, and add a mix of orchid bark, jungle mix (i think is what i saw at my local pet store, like a black earth kindof stuff.), fiber moss, and coco husk, mix is determined by what you think is best. You can cover the soils surface with forest floor which is highly recommended even over moss. to provide a place for springtails and isopods to flourish.
2. Select plants that can grow in med-high humidity, and anywhere from low to high light. Lights (t5 highly recommended) are more for your plants and not the frogs. Try to plant your tanks with few species of plants as it may get cramped looking if you use to many in the space you're provided.
3. Although bromeliads are great frogs may lay eggs in them which will make it difficult for removal, especially if the plant is planted inside the tank. (if you planted it in a small pot burried under the surface would that make it easier to extract the plant and eggs?)
4. High humidity, temps between 60-80F with 70-75F is just about perfect. A fan will highly benefit your vivarium as it will cause CO2 to flow, and keep your tank walls from fogging to much.
5. Provide a small air screen on the lid of your vivarium, approx: .5" the rest being glass. (i would love to see how to build a glass top if anyone has a link. my plan was to have like one sheet split 2/3:1/3, on the crack i would attach a hinge and on the smaller part handles for opening. on the back part i would drill 3-4 holes all dependent on the size of the tank. I would love to be able to find an idea where i could make screw on caps so i can remove them if i was to put in a misting system or i saw the CO2 bug removing, plant growing idea where you flood the tank with co2. frogs out of course, let me know what you think)
6. Don't waste too much money on a water system your frogs won't use it, and if bugs can't get out it will just fill up with dead bugs. I do like them but after hearing that frogs might not use it often i might add a few more plants instead.
7. need a temp and humidity gauge.

Basic Frog Care:
+at bare minimum it's 10g/frog, it's best to have at least a 20 gallon tank that you can plant, and frogs have room, 10 gallon tanks often limit a frog, and your ability to use the space to build a vivarium.
+Many species once they reach breeding maturity prefer a 1:1 ration male to female, but a 1:2 ration can also work. correct me if i'm wrong i almost want to say i read somewhere it 2:1 m:f.
+feed your frogs a variety of food not just fruit flies, but small pinhead crickets, isopods, springtails, mini mealworms, grubs? dusted with vitamin/calcium supplements
+young frogs as long as they're the same size will live happily together.
+i've heard mixing species...i don't plan to do that haha
+they breath through their skin
+make sure they appear strong and active when choosing a frog.
+acclimation is pretty rapid if the tanks set up correctly


Make sure you have cultures of food going before you get your frogs


Plant/decor intro to viv:
Plants:
1. remove all dirt from your plants, and submerge in a 10% chlorine solution for 5 minutes. take it out let it sit for 5 mins, rinse in a water for 5mins.
2. I've also heard of the CO2 method but i heard it won't kill eggs.
Decor:
driftwood: bake in the oven at 350F for 10mins? i didn't read to much here, do you soak the wood first? it won't catch fire right haha, i did hear people do that with driftwood or the co2 thing for driftwood.
wild collected rocks: bleach solution same as plants or bake like wood

few questions: ~~~precedes a summed answer

It's true that you use distilled, spring water, or de chlorinated water (like what you would fill your fishtanks with). Is there one type that you would recommend? Or if i reword the question, is there one you prefer to use?
~~~all based on preference...spring or distilled over dechlorinated water....spring or distilled stewed with leaves to create tad water

Once you plant the tank, is it beneficial to seed your tank with springtails and/or isopods before adding frogs? Will the frogs be able to control the population?
~~~Recommended, seed 2weeks before you add your frogs

Will all veterinarian's do the "stool sample"? i will contact mine incase i have problems, i could see them doing something like that, but i'm not sure if they would see them for broken limb or actually treat them for a disease since most of mine are for dogs/cats/animals. but i guess you never know until you ask. Let me know if you've delt with a vet other than a stool sample

I haven't read too much on breeding yet, so i can't summarize that...i have a little...

1. Once eggs are laid let them sit in the tank for 24-48hrs to ensure they've been fertilized.
2. when removing eggs and relocating them into separate dishes, be careful not to flip the eggs over as they have a top and bottom.
3. once the front legs pop out tilt the container, and possibly set it inside a small tank? could you do that with multiple tadpoles? or is it best to keep them separate until they're all frogs.
4. a small water pool is beneficial to you when collecting the eggs when you're breeding them. camera canister, petri dishes, help for easy egg removal. difficulties may arise if they lay them on plants, where you will have to scrape the eggs off careful not to puncture or disturb them too much remove with credit card or razor.
5. fertilized eggs will have a dark brown/black circle inside them the forming tadpole, unfertilized eggs will remain white and should be removed if they outnumber fertilized eggs because they mold.
6. care for frog eggs vary, some frogs take care of the eggs, some don't, some tadpoles are cannabalistic, some aren't, some parents eat the eggs, some only eat the unfertilized eggs, some won't touch them at all.

^^like i said i still have to read a little on this part...

I have two tanks at the moment i think i'm setting both up for frogs. i may have another tank coming too.

30g 12"x14"x36"
20g long not sure on dimensions i think 30"x12"x12"? something close
possibly another 30g tall? 30"x19x12

I'm looking to get...

D. azureus
D. tinctorious
D. auratus
D. Leucomelas

i will most likely start out with one though probably d. azureus.

can i fit 3-4+ frogs in a planted 30 gallon tank? if so how does the ratio continue.

Do i sound ready for getting frogs? after i get my tank set up?

let me know, happy to join the hobby and forum
nice to meet you all
dustin
 

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Sounds like you definately did your research. Great choice on first frogs as well. You could put 3-4 in a 30g for quite a while, just watch for aggression at a later age. You could probably keep a 2.1 permanently without any issues in there (depends on frogs personalities of course).

Great write up on the basics as well... good for beginners. Covers all basis. Should be chopped out of your personal message and stickied. LOL

Cant wait to see pics!
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
haha i was thinking that someone might say that :D. Let me get a few more replies and if i can get some answers to my questions i might rewrite it with the answers and see if someone can sticky it.

I might do a timelapse of my tank getting put together if i have time:)
 

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Sorry was so in depth in reading I forgot to answer your questions..

Yes seed with springtails or isos or both before frogs.. let them get established.. as far as water.. RO/DI is if you wanna go all out.. I just use bottled spring water with no issue.

As far as vet, im not sure. There is a guy who frequents here that someone will recommend. Just cant recall his name now.
 

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first, 5 gallons/frog is a little small, most people RECOMMEND [not mandatory] 10 gallons/frog, but 3-4 in a 30 is fine...


answers are in red:

few questions:

It's true that you use distilled, spring water, or de chlorinated water (like what you would fill your fishtanks with). Is there one type that you would recommend? Or if i reword the question, is there one you prefer to use?

It depends on the persons preference, i dont have tads yet [i have breeders, but they wont lay eggs!!!], but I plan on using 'tadwater' which, is boiling a couple leaves in water, releasing tannins creating a 'perfect' environment for the tads...
I've also heard of people using rainwater with good results.

Once you plant the tank, is it beneficial to seed your tank with springtails and/or isopods before adding frogs? Will the frogs be able to control the population?
Before, so the microfauna have enugh time to establish, i usually add them about 2 weeks prior to adding frgs.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 · (Edited)
Thanks Boabab95 & deboardfam

I made some modification to the top, i'll let you know if i have any other questions right now i'm reading through the forum

@boa: hope you get some eggs soon :D
 

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To chime on his.. I also use spring water bottled for my tads as well. Working well. My INIBICO variablis just popped his front legs yesterday.. now the other two need to catch up!
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Oh nice hope you post pics somewhere, thanks i'll have to add it to a word doc, i guess you're allowed 60mins of editing time, haha so now i can't edit it....

here's another question:

Can i culture isopodes from outside? and after a few generations of home culturing would they be safe for a vivarium? or should i get them from a member to ensure they're safe? i would think that most may have started from a wild population
 

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I personaly wouldnt get them from outside.. even if its okay there is always that thought in the back of your head that you brought something in. LOL.
I have used mosses and driftwood from outside but after a heavy cleaning or baking in the oven (the wood). Also used leaf litter from outside after boiling for a long time.
 
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