[fishr]

Searchs on Dendroboard and the Net itself aren't turning up clues to answer my question, I have learned dosing twice a month is acceptable and to be careful of over doing it.

Thanks guys
Jessica

 

[vivlover10]

I believe it is important to breeding. Something like egg structure.

 

[oddlot]

Lack of vitamin A in the parents has been linked to spindly leg issues in froglets.Ed has posted about this quite a few times. Maybe search spindly leg.
Lou

 

[fishr]

Oh I will do that. Thanks for the tip
`

 

[Ed]

Often it is due to not using the correct search terms (and search function), search retinyl (actual vitamin A instead of vitamin A)...

Immune system, fertility, stickyness of mucous membranes (enables prey capture with a sticky tongue) development of embryos and tadpoles...basically many of the same things it does in other vertebrates...


Ed

 

[fishr]

Interesting. Now if I am not interesting letting eggs morph? How critical is Vit A than? Seems immune system and the stickiness of the tongue are the factors for my position. What about Vit C to enhance immunity? And Zinc?

 

[Ed]

Interesting. Now if I am not interesting letting eggs morph? How critical is Vit A than? Seems immune system and the stickiness of the tongue are the factors for my position. What about Vit C to enhance immunity? And Zinc?

If they are deficient in vitamin A in the form of a retinoid (since beta carotene appears to be poorly converted (and this is the main form of vitamin A supplied to the frogs)), then you run multiple risks of death or illness as it changes the ability to uptake and absorb nutrients, and reduces the mucosal protections from pathogens and the ability to respond to pathogens and stress.

Why would you want to increase the level of vitamin C in the diet over and above that supplied by the dusting given that there isn't any indication that there is any deficiency of vitamin C?

You are aware that frogs and tadpoles are sensitive to elevated levels of zinc (above that provided by supplements)?

Ed

 

[fishr]

Forgive me for jumping the gun. For humans, when we become ill say with the common cold, to increase our immune system, it is suggested to not only stay hydrated but Vit C and Zinc help fight of 'the bug.' That was my train of thought.

Thank you Ed for clearing my confusion. I never knew the purpose of Vitamin A, nor did I know frogs and tads were sensitive to elevated levels of Zinc. Learn something new every day.

Have a good day.

 

[fishr]

One more question.

I use Repashy's Calcium Plus now thanks to the wonderful advice here. My question is, I believe Calcium Plus has Vit. A already included? Just wondering because Repashy has their new Vitamin A Plus product and I if I'm dusting with Calcium Plus with every feeding if I needed their new product.

Jessica

 

[Ed]

Unless you see signs of insufficient vitamin A, it should be fine as the sole supplement.

Ed

 

[fishr]

What signs would indicate insufficient vitamin A absorbtion so I know for future reference. Thank you, Ed.

Jessica

 

[Ed]

Loss of mucous on the tongue, infections, death...

Ed

 

[fishr]

Loss of mucous on the tongue, infections, death...

Ed

Well we don't want death.

Have there been cases where a dart frog will approach its prey, 'act hungry' and appear to be hunting, but can't or has difficulty opening its mouth?

I am asking because this behavior is what I am observing in a cobalt I have seperated. It is thin.

Much thanks in your patience, Ed.

Jessica

 

[MeiKVR6]

Loss of mucous on the tongue, infections, death...

Ed

And SLS in froglets, if I remember right.

 

[fishr]

SLS? I'm not good with abbreviations.

 

[MeiKVR6]

SLS? I'm not good with abbreviations.

Spindly leg syndrome.

 

[fishr]

Ah, thanks.

I'm concerned now about the cobalt I have seperated. It is obviously hungry and actively walks with all four limbs without any visable problems. However, the flys I dusted and put in the sterlight bin are still there. The flies do have a feeding station also to make it easier on the frog.

I am now wondering about there is a vit. deficiency happening.

Rundown of my husbandry in regards to feeding:

-Feed all frogs twice a day, dusted with Calcium Plus. I culture black hydei, melos, gray and white isos and tropical spring tails. Frog's menu with flies are rotated each day.

-I purchased 3 Cobalts (since 1 is in question) on Dec. the week before the 25th. (Please PM me if you'd like to know the name of vendor).

-I only recently started dosing Calcium Plus approx. three months ago. Before I was supplementing with Exo Terra's Calcium+D3 and Multivitamin until the feedback I learned about Repashy's calcium/vit supplement.

Hope that is enough information to help determining if there is a deficiency going on.

Much thanks!
Jessica

 

[Ed]

Is there an actual issue with the jaw opening or is the frog able to open it's mouth and there is an issue with tongue mechanics or does the frog appear to miss the flies? In the first two, it could be due to mechanical trauma, disruption of calcium metabolism, while the second and third options could be due to insufficient vitamin A.

Ed

 

[Ed]

And SLS in froglets, if I remember right.

Yes, but I think it was cited earlier that reproduction was unlikely.

Ed

 

[SmackoftheGods]

Reproductive issues ranging anywhere from infertility to SLS might be indicative of vitamin A deficiency. It's probably a good idea not to jump the gun on the vitamin A thing, though. Some frogs are particularly difficult to breed in general (R. uakarii comes to mind...). And just because a frog is getting skinny doesn't necessarily mean there's a vitamin deficiency.... Personally I'd look for multiple symptoms before treating as overdosing can have negative side effects.

My understanding is that ICB and Superpig have enough vitamin A to maintain the levels of vitamin A in a frog's system, but don't have enough to treat for vitamin A deficiency. Basically, if you have a frog with healthy levels then dusting with Repashy Calcium and/or Superpig should keep them at that level. However, if you have frogs with low vitamin A, dusting with ICB and/or Superpig won't fix the problem, only keep the problem from getting worse....