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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I went to check on my 4 month old froglets (3) in there small 128oz grow-out container and they were all dead. I raised the, from tadpoles that I got in december. This is my first time having frogs and I don't know what happened. I fed them yesterday and they were all doing great (active, eating, no aggression). When I checked on them today, they were all liquified and black globs of dead frog. I feed them fruit flies dusted with repashy calcium+ and they are in a 128 oz plastic container with sphagnum moss, leaf litter, pothos clippings and a coco hut. They have been great until this. Help! Any advice or ideas? They are dendrobates tinctorius "Cobalt Blue" and I got them from @joshsfrogs.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I don’t have pictures because I threw it out. The ventilation was good because they were thriving for 4 months and it is what was recommended by Joshs Frogs.
 

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I don’t have pictures because I threw it out. The ventilation was good because they were thriving for 4 months and it is what was recommended by Joshs Frogs.
Without pictures it's going to be difficult for anyone to diagnose what the issue may have been.

I will say that container sounds exceedingly small for 3 froglets. Equates out to 3.6L if my math is right. I keep individual Ranitomeya froglets in bigger containers than that. I don't think it's what caused then to die, but who knows.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I can't get pictures. There was no aggression and they were thriving until today. The only thing I can think of is that I rinsed half of the sphagnum and added a few additional leaves for leaf litter.
 

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In 24 hours they went from live frogs to liquefied black globs?

Off the top of my head, that little container must have been very wet and very soiled for that to happen.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
In 24 hours they went from live frogs to liquefied black globs?

Off the top of my head, that little container must have been very wet and very soiled for that to happen.
Correct. It wasn't over-humid. If anything, it was a little too dry. The container may have been slightly small, but there was no aggression and they had been living init for 3-4 months.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I take that back. I just retrieved them to get a picture. One was too liquified to get a good picture but here are the other two.
IMG_4369.jpg IMG_4370.jpg
 

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Pictures of the container would probably be more helpful at this point.

You didn't take any pictures of the container while they were growing?
 

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I find it highly unlikely they went from hopping around and eating to liquid goo in 24 hours.
The only chance that could happen is if you had created an anaerobic environment. Which could only happen if there was no ventilation and just an ungodly amount of frog crap strewn across way too wet substrate. Even then, I think it unlikely they turned to goo in 24 hours.
 

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Almost certainly CO2 buildup from frog respiration, decomposition of organics and excess CO2 in houses during the summer (windows closed, houses hold a lot of CO2).

As mentioned, that's too small a container even for a single thumb froglet (I've tried this size, too). Three 4 month old tincs (well, if you had them for four months, that puts them at more than half a year old at the very least) should be in something about ten gallons, with good ventilation, in my opinion.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Makes sense. The frogs are only about 3 months old since metamorphosis. The cause makes sense, I just don't understand how it was so rapid with no hints.
 

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Makes sense. The frogs are only about 3 months old since metamorphosis. The cause makes sense, I just don't understand how it was so rapid with no hints.
That's the thing that makes no sense.

To double down on fishingguy, this isn't your fault. You were given terrible advice.
 

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I misinterpreted the age; I missed the part about raising from tads. It doesn't affect my suspicions, though, unless some more evidence about ventilation is available -- you haven't described it at all. We're operating off the link you provided, which shows an unpunched deli cup as far as I can see.

CO2 can kill in a few minutes. Sublethal concentrations are not always detectable by behavior, certainly not in ectothermic animals. An animal always dies rapidly: first it is alive, then it is dead.

The 'no hints' part is why many of us are such aggravating police about little things like ventilation (and temps, and supplements, and proper sex ratios, and so on). Animals don't tend to give hints before they die -- they're both very good at hiding their suffering, and in any event don't reliably have the sort of simple-to-interpret responses that people and some domestic animals have.

More info would certainly help people give suggestions as to what happened.
 

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What happened in the prior 48 before all of the frogs were found dead?

Everything that the frogs incurred? No matter how routine?
 

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I am wondering if a peak of acute externals combined to cause a mechanical death in your froglets..

Chlorine/choramine in sop contact of sphag in a small, poorly ventilated plastic container, along with stagnant air. Choramine impairs red bloodcells capacity to carry oxygen.

I dont know how to approach discussing this. Ive housed froglets differently with so much more open ventilation and so successfully I was given froglets to raise to Sub Ad.

But no one is really going to study this unfortunately. The best thing is to investigate all relevant aspects.
 
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