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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Well as some of you may notice in some of my threads earlier Im setting up a 166 gallon viv for pumilio and I'd love to put a pair or better a trio of escudo's in it, and Id like to know a bit about them since I cant find much on google. How large to they get I know they are the smaller ones of the pumilio. What do you guys use in there environment ect. and a price range for a pair or trio would be nice. Thanks
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I know but I want something that will raise its own tadpoles and utilize the whole tank like pumilio
 

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the biggest thing about what your considering is the size of the frogs and their territoriality. they are small! VERY small. and most (that ive seen) seem to have a subtle mixture of blue and red. making them blend in pretty well. a 160 gal tank with 3 frogs that are tiny and blend in well, may end up being something your not as interested in, so its something to consider.

now about the frogs specifically, they are a frog that comes from a small island in the bocas region of panama (as most pumilio do), however there is a continuing trend to classify them as a distinct species. so not pumilio at all. they are often referred to as Oophaga sp. 'escudo', this along with the fact that they are an obligate egg feeder, means that they are priced pretty high. that price has dropped some in the past year with the newer imports but still remains pretty high. i would expect a trio to go for $600+

i would personally suggest a more colorful and larger frog like almirante/ MC, or bastis, el dorado, christobal, nancy, etc. OR a large colony of ranitomeya. something like fants could do well in a large tank and you could fit many more in it than pumilio (comfortably and with minimal stress)

james
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I was debateing a group of inquitos vents but I'm gonna wait till the tanks ready and ill see what you guys and my family think I should put in it
 

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Nancy/Solarte for the tank may not be the greatest idea IMO. While they are for the most part a more vivid hue than the escudo they are still the same in size. But like James said, a nice group of Bastis, Cristobal, or El Dorado would probably be most enjoyable.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Yah, I really do like the cristos, the basti's are ok and so are El Dorado they are unique in different ways so Im gonna have a rough time choosing :D
 

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My Nancy/Solarte are appreciably bigger than my Escudo.
 

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Yes Nancy's are about 25% larger than Escudo's but in a 166 you could easily have 4 or 5. I had a 1.2 group in a 20 that bred well for me until I separated them, they are a great project and worthy of a large tank. This is a species/morph that I think may not come in again and if so maybe 1 or 2 more times at most. I have 2 pair and won't get rid of them for that reason alone.
If you put one of the thumbs in there that takes care of tads, likely within a year you would have 3 to 4 times the frogs you originally started with.
 

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Hmmm....I have kept a handful or so of each solarte and escudo and the only size difference I may have seen would have been nominal, but then I never put a tape measure to them.
 

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The adult escudo I've seen are closer, in size, to retics than other pumilio. I say if you have experience keeping darts then go for the escudo. They're great little frogs and as obligates would be great in a large tank (although depending on the boldness of the individula frogs may not be terribly visible).

if you don't have sufficient experience keeping darts I'd save the escudo for later. They combine the size challenges you would confront with retics, and the obligation you would get with pumilio. Really a pretty advanced frog.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 · (Edited)
Retics are nice looking and the El dorado have caught my eye I don't know Its gonna be tough I was also thinking of a group of inquitos vents

EDIT could I have a 1:3 ratio of El dorado or no.
From what I heard earier you can have a nice group of them?
 

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Hi Bailey,

The Iquitos Vents would be a very good choice for a large viv. They can be kept as a group frog, they have a really neon color that stands out in the viv, and they are very active. They can be a bit shy to start, but become bolder as they get used to the viv.

At least that's my experiecne with them

Richard.

Retics are nice looking and the El dorado have caught my eye I don't know Its gonna be tough I was also thinking of a group of inquitos vents

EDIT could I have a 1:3 ratio of El dorado or no.
From what I heard earier you can have a nice group of them?
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Yah so far its down to iquitos group and a 1:2 El dorado group I really love the look of both but I figured pums because the size of the tank would offer variuos egg laying sites and visual barriers I see how it works out. Well now its off to a big garage sale to hopefully find some tanks ;)
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
I got a 30 tall tank the other night and they will be going with that and I decided on a group of El Dorado 1:2
 

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Another vote here for the vents. I don't know about the Iquitos locality overly, but vents usually THRIVE in communal groups. My Rio Napa and Borja Ridge vents are about as bold as any dart frog gets, and they use every cm of viv space, whether vertical or horizontal, that they can get to.

You WILL see them, even in such a big tank, and they will allow you a much bigger group size. They will actually also care for their own young if you let them. My Rio Napa vents are currently caring for their first small brood of 3 tads as I wanted to experience seeing the parental care, even if just the once. Unlike pums (or Escudos, if youa re going to consider them separate) however if you need to pull the eggs or tads for whatever reason you can do so happy in the knowledge that they will still do fine.

Ade
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Ive acutally been debating several size tanks I think Im going to by a 70 tall from glass cages and put a divider in the middle and have basicly 2 18x18x25 terrariums and them i will blend them together to make them look natural and like its still just one big tank. Then im probably gonna put some El dorado in one side then escudo in the other I think that would be pretty neat
 
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