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all right brent, thought you could help me out with all your high and mighty mathematical formulae.... :) I have been constructing something along the lines of what this thread was about....The equations that you have mentioned are refering to a case in which the energy flow is light to producer to primary consumer to secondary consumer....i am not attempting to do this in the system i am building....i have given up on the closed system applications given my apartment is pretty limited in space and light exposure....so i have opted to build an open system, but an open system which is one "step removed"....i have divided a sizable tank in half (about 18"x15"x24" for each half) i seperated them with tree fern planks and sealed all frog sized cracks with a secret bentonite clay mixture :wink: Left hand side is going to be a compost pile and the right hand side is going to be an epiphyte/moss viv with a pair of imitators (or whatever thumbnails i have extra of). I have read a few books on soil ecology and composting techniques and plan on building a compost pile that will optimize invertebrate density. I have vertical airstones through the compost pile to maintine high aerobic conditions and to also prevent CO2 buildup in the glass enclosed tank. My plan is to use the compost functionally for kitchen scraps and terrarium trimmings and at the same time hopefully significantly supplement the feeding of the frogs. Also the compost pile side is set up on false bottom and the water which collects under the compost will have trickeled through the depths of the decomposing goodness and will be harvested to be re-applied to the growth side of the terrarium. It will be pretty neat looking i think, split and half with decay on one side and growth on the other.....I am to the point now where i just need to start adding compost and planting.....how much invert prey do you think i can produce?????? It is really all about trying to maximize space with little tricks on the compost side, making it as productive as possible...i realize i will have to empty the compost side and start over every now and then but still should be a cool experiment...ben
 
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