Dendroboard banner

1 - 20 of 21 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
313 Posts
Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Apologies for being a bit long-winded, I'm trying to give you all the information surrounding these new breeding attempts in my group:

I have a group of Blackfoot oranges -- 1.4 to my knowledge, about 11-12 months old give or take.

Just about a week ago, 2 of the females started showing a bit of aggression to the other females and each other. Very light wrestling and chasing, nothing that would stop the others eating or shrugging them off.

The largest female paired off with my male, who has been calling on and off for a long time but this time it was obviously on.

(Since then, all aggression has stopped, even from the non-paired female).

After 2 days of intense courtship, with the female following the male, and the male repeatedly sort of 'bowing' to her, I found a first clutch of eggs on a philodendron leaf. I left it in situ most of the day before removing it.

That was 6 days ago; didn't expect a first clutch at this age to be fertile, but as of today 5 of the 7 eggs are developing so I'll wait and see what happens, maybe the tadpoles will be viable, maybe not.

Now that they've started, I provided multiple petri dishes, one under a stump, another beneath some foliage, and a coconut hut over another one of them.

The same pair has spent most of their time together since that first clutch, and this morning after seeing them both in the hut, I spotted what looks to be a second, even bigger clutch, but I opted not to disturb them or the eggs for the day.

Some hours later, I watched the male return to the hut alone after a bout of calling, and position himself over the eggs.

1. I had read that leaving eggs for the male to fertilize is considered outdated info, as he will fertilize a spot on which the female will then lay the egg mass.

2. Was he fertilizing them twice out of instinct or for "insurance"?

3. When they were in the hut today, someone was definitely on top of someone else. I walked away rather than disturb them to see what was what.

I'm going to leave the eggs there for most of the day once again. As I'm typing this I hear the male calling again, but so far only the bigger of the 2 presumably dominant females pays him any attention.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
260 Posts
1. I do believe it's outdated info as I've pulled fertile eggs very shortly after being laid.

2. Could have been wetting them or guarding them from being eaten by the other females.

3. Yep, my yellow terribilis male will hug the female as she's laying. Possibly fertilizing as she's laying.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
313 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
1. I do believe it's outdated info as I've pulled fertile eggs very shortly after being laid.

2. Could have been wetting them or guarding them from being eaten by the other females.

3. Yep, my yellow terribilis male will hug the female as she's laying. Possibly fertilizing as she's laying.
Thanks. I know leucs and tincs will eat eggs ... terribilis as well? Ever since that pair started courting the other females don't even hang on that side of the tank, although I won't say that's why since they do randomly switch their favourite territories from time to time.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,415 Posts
My Ranitomeya imitator males could often be caught travelling back to fertilized eggs. Once, he appeared to be stomping all over the eggs. Ed informed me that he was re-moistening them.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Fahad

·
Registered
Joined
·
313 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
First clutch (photo taken in situ 6 days ago)




...5 out of 7 eggs are now developing, 2 were obviously bad. Not sure what these will do as they were the first clutch ever.

2nd clutch from today. Looks much better; I guess the 2 eggs right beside each other touching may not be developing properly ...



Quick snapshot of the group taken around 2-3 weeks ago:



One of my females. She’s not the one that paired off, but is the only other one that’s shown evidence of sexual maturity/dominance.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,483 Posts
Those are nice, very exciting. I wouldnt jump to conclusions about those eggs it may not be what it looks like. More of a juncture overlap than a circus tad.

Yeah I like those black foots
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,483 Posts
I have a large tiered piece of Malaysian wood, it looks like a crescent stair of rustic surfing boards. I got it specifically with Terribilis in mind but I dont think I'm going to be able to do it this year. I'd give it to you if I could.

There could be straight up set of healthy twins, that also happens more than anything bizarre.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,415 Posts
My Allobates zaparo used to throw the occasional double egg. They would hatch out into 2 headed tadpoles, but they never survived more than a week or two. One time she threw a triple head.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Fahad

·
Registered
Joined
·
313 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
I have a large tiered piece of Malaysian wood, it looks like a crescent stair of rustic surfing boards. I got it specifically with Terribilis in mind but I dont think I'm going to be able to do it this year. I'd give it to you if I could.

There could be straight up set of healthy twins, that also happens more than anything bizarre.

Thanks for the thought nonetheless. So as of now, I have 4 eggs from the first ever clutch of 7 developing, recognizable tadpoles with a bit of movement. The one developing egg died for whatever reason.

So for clutch #1 — 3 non-starters, 1 early loss by day 8.

The second clutch of 14 still looks good across the board and those paired eggs look like twins rather than conjoined, so looks like you’re right about that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,331 Posts
They will be all fine in a few clutches. Terribilis has twins in their clutches all the time, sometimes even multiple.

Your frogs are absolutley beautifull! What a great color on these!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
313 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
Clutch #3 about 10 days after the last one. Couple of eggs look dodgy but it’s bigger than the last.

As for the previous clutches, wound up with 3 tadpoles out of the 5 that began to develop from the first 7 eggs.

The 2nd clutch may be problematic (or not) as the eggs seem to be developing at different rates; I don’t know if that has anything to do with viability but I’ll check the archives.

The frogs themselves are looking good and remain paired off; I’m keeping an eye on their nutrition and letting them figure it out.








Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,115 Posts
When my blackfoots got going, they really got going. Large clutches with great frequency. With that said, I experienced higher mortality with their eggs and tads than any of the other frogs that I have kept. I fooled around with their supplement regime several times to see if I could see better results, but to no avail. Either way, they are awesome frogs.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
313 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
I haven’t had a great hatch rate as of 6 clutches, but the issue *appears* to be that no more than 6 or so ever get fertilized, although clutches have ranged from 7 to 22 eggs.

My frogs are barely a year old so that may be a factor.

The odd tadpole has halted development before hatching, but I’ve only lost one tad-in-water so far, and that very early on.

That particular one seemed to randomly spazz out and act very hyper, maybe that was indicative of a systemic problem or pathogen? Its clutch-mates are fine.

My group gets a pretty varied diet and supplementation should be adequate, so I’m looking forward to seeing if the fertility rate improves at all.

I’m also already planning to try and halt their breeding by adjusting food and misting or even separating if need be.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
313 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
First clutch laid on May 7th, hatched around May 23rd, first tad to have presented forelimbs on Day 80, now the first hanging around outside of the water as of day 82:




Some siblings very close behind, with many more from later clutches bringing up the rear.

Not like I’ve never seen this before, but still somehow shocking.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,828 Posts
First clutch laid on May 7th, hatched around May 23rd, first tad to have presented forelimbs on Day 80, now the first hanging around outside of the water as of day 82:




Some siblings very close behind, with many more from later clutches bringing up the rear.

Not like I’ve never seen this before, but still somehow shocking.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Congratulations!!!
This is great.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
313 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
Been a long time since I’ve updated this thread; I post a lot more to Instagram ...

... so in short, this group has been a success. Most of the clutches are from a dominant female (not the largest female but a skilled combatant when it — rarely — comes down to it) and male pairing; other females sneak a clutch in from time to time but they don’t have the experience so their success rate and clutch size lags behind slightly.

Hatch rate on clutches hovers around 89% at this point. I started scaling back on food and misting in November for a dry season I’ll maintain until February or March and reproduction slowed, eventually halting by mid-November or so; until Jan 2 when they surprised me with a clutch. Whoops.

I’ve tried leaving 2 clutches in situ to see what happens and the results are dire: clutches mysteriously disappear or get flipped over and disrupted by rival females. Foul play!

Currently awaiting the 2nd wave of froglets to colour up and reach a size appropriate for sale.

Hatched on June 5th:






Adults:








Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
313 Posts
Discussion Starter #19
Congrats! Beautiful frogs! Thanks for the updates. Don't forget about us here!
Thanks! I won't forget - LOL - just need some time to get some good properly edited photos together. Have Mint froglets on land right now, which is very exciting.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,115 Posts
Thanks! I won't forget - LOL - just need some time to get some good properly edited photos together. Have Mint froglets on land right now, which is very exciting.
Share on the mints as well! Dude the pics above are some of the best and most representative photos of the blackfoots out there. Not sure there needs to be any editing. But won't argue with more photos haha. Nice job Fahad. Really happy for you and your frogs. Cheers
 
1 - 20 of 21 Posts
Top