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What country are these coming in from? I thought these guys had a pretty limited range that left them in countries that weren't exporting.
Corey brings out a great point, where are they coming from? I thought they where only found in French Guyana, are they found in other countries?

WWF: EVALUATION OF THE ANIMAL AND PLANT TRADE IN THE GUIANAS PRELIMINARY FINDINGS 2001 pg 13.
http://www.giantotterresearch.com/articles/Guianas_Trade.pdf

...no commercial wildlife exports in French Guiana to government sanctioned and regulated wildlife trade in Guyana and Suriname with important economic benefits. Guyana and Suriname remain the only two countries in South America still exporting significant quantities of wildlife. Suriname and Guyana derive a significant financial income in hard currency (US dollars) and jobs from the export of fauna and flora (Table 1). Meanwhile, French Guiana has well enforced regulations that prohibit the capture, sale or export of wildlife, and only 12 species are allowed to be used for commercial bush meat purposes (and sale in restaurants.)
 

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They came in occasionally years ago (99-00 maybe the last?). How long has French Guyana been locked up? I wondered if it might be a "don't ask, don't tell" sort of situation, or perhaps there are isolated populations in Suriname. Perhaps another species? Flavescens range from mustard, brown, to orange on top, pictures on Google etc. are really variable, so perhaps a few species/or localities are involved? (all bearing that latin do seem to have the hot pink bellies etc.) JVK
 

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The last time they were supposed to be imported the toads that came in were not flavescens...

At one time, it was possible for French citizens to collect and transport frogs into France as it is considered a province which allowed the collectors to avoid CITES regulations as the frogs were transported within "country".
That may have changed...
 

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That still stands...no CITES needed if going direct to France, but other permits are.

The last time they were supposed to be imported the toads that came in were not flavescens...

At one time, it was possible for French citizens to collect and transport frogs into France as it is considered a province which allowed the collectors to avoid CITES regulations as the frogs were transported within "country".
That may have changed...
 

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The last time they were supposed to be imported the toads that came in were not flavescens...

At one time, it was possible for French citizens to collect and transport frogs into France as it is considered a province which allowed the collectors to avoid CITES regulations as the frogs were transported within "country".
That may have changed...
French Guiana is France. I know permits can be issued for aquarium fish but I believe all other vertebrates are protected. I have been twice. My first trip went Seattle to Paris to cayenne. This was quicker and cheaper than the other route available at the time which was Seattle-Houston-Miami-Haiti-guadeloupe- Martinique-cayenne. When returning to Paris there was no customs whatsoever so anything could have been transported. This has also been a main way of smuggling out of brazil. For a $4 boat ride you can cross to oyapok, brazil with no regulations on either side of the river. I have done this trip and it is a complete joke as far as regulations. I haven't been to the Suriname border, but I highly doubt it is too difficult either. The other issue is the collectors which are mostly Amerindians don't follow borders and just travel on the hundreds of rivers in the area.

These same issues happen in Africa with animals from Tanzania. Many of these are only found in south Africa and are easily smuggled to Tanzania which exports. This has complicated things in the scientific community because distributions become suspect and identifications difficult
 

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Wow.....and there you have it.

France (and Germany) just treat those South American countries as provinces and can easily bring back frogs to be "washed" later when they want to ship to the U.S

Sobering.....
 

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Wow.....and there you have it.

France (and Germany) just treat those South American countries as provinces and can easily bring back frogs to be "washed" later when they want to ship to the U.S

Sobering.....
Actually its more like France and Holland, but you aren't far from the truth with your statement;)
 

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Hmmm, I got excited and thought this thread was going to be about Atelopus flavs....
Well here's my opinion, and I'm sticking to it......

I do beleive there are Flavescens type animals in Surinam - Whether they are Flavescens is yet to be seen - However, getting someone to collect them is another situation in itself.....

Will it happen? Eventually, but they are only collecting in the know Spumaris populations at the moment.........Give the guys a year or two of R&D, and they may be able to pull it off........
 

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I would highly doubt actual flavescens was coming in, typically they were actually barbitini. Barbitini went back and forth between being a spumarius subspecies (because it's dorsal patterns were the same as the hoogmoedi, just the pink color rather than yellow/white) or a flavescens subspecies (because the pink belly was the same as flavescens).

Phylogeography and demography of Guianan harlequin toads (Atelopus): diversification within a refuge - Noonan and Gaucher

This is a good read because it breaks down what is going on. Atelopus spumarius is not in the Guianan Shield, leaving A. hoogmoedi, A. barbitini, A. franciscus, A. flavescens, and a weird population known as A. vermiculatus. Long story short, barbitini is not hoogmoedi or flavescens. What is coming in as flavescens is actually barbitini, a population of which DOES occur in Suriname, but most is in French Guiana. Barbitini is more closely related to flavescens than hoogmoedi, but they are not the same species.

Barbitini was thought to be part of flavescens - beyond the coloration - also because of a few interesting pictures from a fun population (examples can be found on this website). This population is addressed in the above paper, referencing A. vermiculatus. This may be an area of hybridization between closely related species (not totally sure what is going on there), but does not mean they are all the same species as it occurs in only one particular area.

The barbitini population in suriname is extremely remote, but it's already been brought in at least once. I'm not sure which would be easier to do... go to the remote area of suriname to get it, or get it from french guiana and smuggle it over (which are also remote areas).
 
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