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Discussion Starter #1
Every breeding day they go into a hut with a dish, then the male circles the dish stomping his back legs. Is their a reason he does this, do your frogs do this? I am currently watching them prepare their whole day adventure of layin eggs.

Interesting to watch.
 

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Perhaps he is signaling the female to lay her eggs there?

It seems and awful lot like the way a Thumbnail might call a female over to specific broms to lay her eggs...
 

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My panamanian auratus do that,the female will go into the hut and the male stays in front of the door and stomps his back feet or if she comes out he will follow her around doing this.
 

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My leucs do this "dance" a lot when they breed. The male and even the female do "happy feet" and rapidly start stepping in place. I don't know if maybe they are checking to see if they have found a suitable place to lay eggs, or if it's just courtship, or something else.
Bryan
 

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My p.aurotaenia did that the first day in the viv,not all of them did this though,could this be males marking territory?
 

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If you get a copy of Breeding Terrarium Animals by Elke Zimmerman, you can compare the behaviors described in there with the ones you are seeing.

It is probably part of a courtship ritual.

Ed
 

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If you get a copy of Breeding Terrarium Animals by Elke Zimmerman, you can compare the behaviors described in there with the ones you are seeing.

It is probably part of a courtship ritual.

Ed
My aurotaenia aren't sexually mature though
 

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My aurotaenia aren't sexually mature though
I was referring to the OP...

In reference to your comment, while there is evidence that some dendrobatids can use olfaction to locate thier home range, there isn't anything that demonstrates territorial marking (in pumilio they can find a certain bromeliad..). In any case, territorial marking isn't common in subadult vertebrates.. one of the reasons is because if subadults began to mark territories they would be in competition with the adults which means that aggression would start with them as juveniles....
 

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I should also add that no glands for territorial marking have been identified in anurans....
 

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Odd,very odd indeed,could this be a new behavior expressed in certain phyllobates species not yet identified or seen already but given no thought to?:confused:
 

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was it like this???


This was a few weeks ago right before my Amazonica laid a clutch. I just caught my FG vent doing the same dance right before finding a clutch of 12. Clearly it drives the ladies wild.

-brett
 

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my leucs do the foot stamping thing a lot. My imis do the robot walk. Its very jerky, and deliberate looking. Just part of the awesomness of witnessing animal behavior
 

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I was referring to the OP...

In reference to your comment, while there is evidence that some dendrobatids can use olfaction to locate thier home range, there isn't anything that demonstrates territorial marking (in pumilio they can find a certain bromeliad..). In any case, territorial marking isn't common in subadult vertebrates.. one of the reasons is because if subadults began to mark territories they would be in competition with the adults which means that aggression would start with them as juveniles....
i was thinking visual marking, for instance if another frog(possibly male)saw a tankmate doing this he/she would not go near that area
 

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i was thinking visual marking, for instance if another frog(possibly male)saw a tankmate doing this he/she would not go near that area

Visually marking or visual signaling? They are two different things.. In addition, if the subadults begin to "mark" or "signal" territorial claims, they are going to be in direct competition with the adults, which means that there will be strong aggression from adults on the juveniles. The reason for this is that the amount of time that an animal remains in a territory, the better it may be able to defend that territory.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
was it like this???

YouTube - Ranitomeya Ventrimaculata "Amazonica" courting

This was a few weeks ago right before my Amazonica laid a clutch. I just caught my FG vent doing the same dance right before finding a clutch of 12. Clearly it drives the ladies wild.

-brett
It was not that, but it was this:

MVI_0979.mp4 video by smilexelectric - Photobucket

Note: These are my frogs in the video.

All I have to say to that video is, dont stop get it get it, dont stop get it get it. Hahaha.
 

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Visually marking or visual signaling? They are two different things.. In addition, if the subadults begin to "mark" or "signal" territorial claims, they are going to be in direct competition with the adults, which means that there will be strong aggression from adults on the juveniles. The reason for this is that the amount of time that an animal remains in a territory, the better it may be able to defend that territory.
visual signaling,for an example when a frog sees another frog do this it would not go near,it would seem that if the juveniles were far enough from the adults territory they could do this and fight among fellow juveniles in that area to establish dominance and territory,then when the next generatuon gets to the juvenail stage they migrate to another region and this goes on throughout the generations
 

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Given that dendrobatids are known to defend egg and tadpole deposition sites and that territorial actions are known to be triggered when a frog can see a conspecific that is behaving like an adult (and showing territorial displays qualifys), and it is stretching the idea that the juveniles would come out of the water in unoccupied territory.. (particularly when some species can defend an area as large as 81 square meters under certain conditions)... and that juveniles would have a hard time defending against an adult that is already occupying the territory, it seems pretty counter to survivial to have immature animals engaging in territorial displays that would get the snot kicked out of them by an adult of the same species.

There is a fair bit of literature on this topic and this is a decent start http://www.unet.univie.ac.at/~a0502587/Nectophrynoides_tornieri_files/Proehl,%20territorial%20behavior%20in%20dendrobatid%20frogs.pdf


For those that have a copy, I also suggest checking out the diagrams of the courtship rituals in Terrarium Animals by Elke Zimmerman, TFH Publications.
 

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Given that dendrobatids are known to defend egg and tadpole deposition sites and that territorial actions are known to be triggered when a frog can see a conspecific that is behaving like an adult (and showing territorial displays qualifys), and it is stretching the idea that the juveniles would come out of the water in unoccupied territory.. (particularly when some species can defend an area as large as 81 square meters under certain conditions)... and that juveniles would have a hard time defending against an adult that is already occupying the territory, it seems pretty counter to survivial to have immature animals engaging in territorial displays that would get the snot kicked out of them by an adult of the same species.

There is a fair bit of literature on this topic and this is a decent start http://www.unet.univie.ac.at/~a0502587/Nectophrynoides_tornieri_files/Proehl,%20territorial%20behavior%20in%20dendrobatid%20frogs.pdf


For those that have a copy, I also suggest checking out the diagrams of the courtship rituals in Terrarium Animals by Elke Zimmerman, TFH Publications.
i meant that the tads come out of the water IN an occupied area but then at the juvenial stage migrate TO an unoccupied area,sorry for the confusion:eek:
 
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