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I was wondering if anyone around here is actively breeding either one of these lines (Todd Kelly / Phil Tan)?

Been doing some major research on these and have found out after the whole UE interbreeding with Iquitos has made their lines pretty much impossible to find. I was just curious if anyone out there has a pure bloodline of either type (which are actually the same amazonicus) and sell them?

Any comments/tips on where to find these guys appreciated!:D
 

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Re: Todd Kelly/Phil Tan Amazonicus

Been doing some major research on these and have found out after the whole UE interbreeding with Iquitos has made these guys pretty much impossible to find. I was just curious if anyone out there has a pure bloodline of either type (which are actually the same amazonicus) and sell them?
Whoa!!! Back up! "UE interbreeding of Iquitos"? What exactly do you mean by that comment? Are you seriously accusing Understory Enterprises of interbreeding their Iquitos amazonicus with a different line? Do you have any evidence to back that up? I refuse to believe it without some hard proof. I think your research has gone very badly astray.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I'm going off another thread that was on here awhile back discussing the two different lines and how when they were imported how the two species for jumbled. Maybe interbreeding was the wrong word. My apologies sincerely. I just want to find a Kelley red amazonicus line.


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Re: Todd Kelly/Phil Tan Amazonicus

Is it possible that you are confusing the cross that Herptalogic has produced? That was a cross of Todd Kelly's Amazonicus and Understory Enterprise's Iquitos. Some would argue that they MAY be the same frog anyway, but that is NOT known for a fact. It would require genetic testing. In any case, that cross was NOT done by Understory Enterprises. The Understory line of Iquitos remains pure.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Yes! There we go lol. Knew my wording was bad :/. Sorry!!!! :p. so are the UE a non mixed species?


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Re: Todd Kelly/Phil Tan Amazonicus

Ahh, ok, I think that is what you saw.

You can still find the Kelley line of Amazonicus. In fact, I am raising up some tads I was lucky enough to receive (sorry I can't get more) of the Todd Kelly line of Red Amazonicus. I'm looking forward to restarting my group of them.
I was lucky enough to receive 4 of some of the very first Red Amazonicus that Todd produced, years ago. I found them to be fairly bold, and breeding machines.

You can also still find the Understory line of Amazonicus, including directly from Mark Pepper.

And yes, you can also find a lot floating around that may or may not be of pure lineage.

Good luck finding them. It will be a while, but a couple of us here in Colorado may be working them again in a year or so.
 
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Discussion Starter #7
Is there a sure fire way to make sure they're a good line? Now I'm paranoid as I'd like to breed them and don't want to invest in the mixed.


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Re: Todd Kelly/Phil Tan Amazonicus

Yes! There we go lol. Knew my wording was bad :/. Sorry!!!! :p. so are the UE a non mixed species?


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Yes, the Understory Enterprises line of Iquitos Vents (now amazonicus) IS a pure line. If you get it from a trusted breeder, that is. Be aware that there are also frogs being sold as Understory Enterprises lineage, that may Todd Kelly's Red Amazonicus blood in them. In fact, the Understory lines go beyond being pure lines. They are also KNOWN LOCATION frogs, as opposed to suspected location frogs. That right there is why I am of the opinion that Todd's and Mark's bloodlines should be kept separate. Mark also states that his known local bloodlines should NOT be crossed with older bloodlines.
(Is this the hundredth time I've said this yet?) Know your breeder, know your breeder, know your breeder! If you truly trust your breeder, you can trust your lineage. Ask everything you can about them BEFORE you purchase them. Ask people here on Dendroboard if your seller is trusted (do this in a private message). I sure don't know everyone, but you can always ask me if I know anything about a certain seller.

They are both fantastic frogs to work with, but I have to admit I have a soft spot in my heart for the Todd Kelly line just because of my past experience with them.
 

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Re: Todd Kelly/Phil Tan Amazonicus

I know that Ron Skylsdale (Skylsdale) has both Kelly lines of amazonicus. He has both the Red vents (Red amazonicus) and the 'Iquitos' vents. Neither of which have or should be crossed with any UE amazonicus.

I have the Kelly 'Iquitos' line and will have some juvies available in a couple months if everything goes as planned.
 

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Re: Todd Kelly/Phil Tan Amazonicus

Thanks Phender. I contacted him and we'll see what he says! Thanks everyone for the supp. Anyone else out there who does breed them please pm me!
 

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Re: Todd Kelly/Phil Tan Amazonicus

You're showing very poor judgement by putting two well respected froggers name in a topic that involved mixed breeding.

I realize that is not your intent - but I almost guarantee that some people, who are not reading the thread completely, picked up that impression from what you said initially.

s
 

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Re: Todd Kelly/Phil Tan Amazonicus

I have a breeding pair of todd kelly amazonicus. They are producing tads often.
 

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Re: Todd Kelly/Phil Tan Amazonicus

Im gonna take this moment to apologize to some very respectable breeders out there. You know who you are... I got way too confused by reading from numerous sites. I didn't mean to offend anyone and I know thanks to one individual whats right.

Sorry to all those!
 
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