[Llehctim]

Hi all,
First, I'd like to thank all of the mod's and others who have gently pushed me to consider upgrading the size of my tank (from 18x18x18) to better suit my trio of terribs. I've spent the last few months reading a lot of old threads and learning more, and it can't be easy to have every newb ask the same dang questions and make the same mistakes.

That being said, I'd been thinking of converting an old aquarium for an upgrade for awhile, but was becoming more complicated than I'd like, so I kept my eye out for a used 50 gallon exoterra. I like the idea of keeping the terrarium components as simple as possible, so I wouldn't need to muck around with fans (passive ventilation for the win), hinging glass doors, etc.

I recently got a used one in good shape and am looking to build it out, and made this thread to track and hopefully get some input.
First question - I know the tank had a snake before, and I will disinfect - but what is a good way to do this? I was thinking 10% bleach solution, but doesn't that need a 10 minute contact time? How would I do that for the sides and glass? Is there a better way than bleach?

I'll also mention the things I'm planning on doing - because I know reading old threads has helped me a lot and when the builders mentioned the reason for doing things it was helpful!

I notice my terribs don't climb much in my setup currently, but they do use wider hardscaped areas as opposed to the cork branches I currently have that are only about 1-1.5" in diameter - so I am planning to use wider cork flats and rounds to create hardscape that they will hopefully use more.

I also notice that the love using the larger leaves of the heartleaf philodendron I've put in - it's almost like extra layers of leaf litter when it doesn't climb. So I'll try and use some plants with larger leaves that are strong enough to hold their weight.

I also plan to plant some areas of the tank more heavily than the others - the goal would be to create areas with different humidity, light and temperature levels.

Any thoughts and advice appreciated.

 

[Socratic Monologue]

First question - I know the tank had a snake before, and I will disinfect - but what is a good way to do this? I was thinking 10% bleach solution, but doesn't that need a 10 minute contact time? How would I do that for the sides and glass? Is there a better way than bleach?

It is my understanding that wetting surfaces for ten minutes with 70% isopropyl or ethyl alcohol (use a spray bottle) is an effective disinfectant against a range of bacterial and viral pathogens. Ethyl alcohol is harder to source but more effective at inactivating non-enveloped viruses (Ranavirus is enveloped and thus is inactivated by isopropyl).

Cryptosporidium cysts are very hard to inactivate; ammonia or peroxide solutions of high concentration and long contact times are necessary. I found reference to one known pathogenic species in amphibians, Cryptosporidium fragile. Whether snakes are known carriers I do not know.

Incidentally, I personally had a leopard gecko test positive for an unidentified and apparently non pathogenic species of Crypto; I assume lots of animals are carriers of C species that are pathogenic only in other hosts. (I test all incoming reptiles for Cryptosporidium serpentis and saurophilium, but once inadvertently specified a test for the whole genus).

 

[JasonE]

Agree on the 70% alcohol. I grow lion's mane and a couple varieties of oyster mushrooms and I use alcohol whenever possible. Spray it on and just let it evaporate. You don't want 90% isopropyl. It evaporates too quickly to properly sanitize. If you wanted to do bleach, do the 10% solution in a spray bottle, spray the tank down, and then just wipe down with paper towels. At 10% solution, you only need it to contact the surface for 30-60 seconds.

 

[Socratic Monologue]

At 10% solution, you only need it to contact the surface for 30-60 seconds

I respectfully disagree. Published contact times for general pathogen disinfection are typically 10 minutes.

Rationale and Considerations for Chlorine Use in Infection Control for Non- U.S. General Healthcare Settings | Non-U.S. General Healthcare Settings | Clinicians | Ebola (Ebola Virus Disease) | CDC

This page is a guidance document that describes basic recommendations on chlorine use for infection prevention and control, and is intended for Ebola healthcare workers in a non-U.S. general healthcare setting.

www.cdc.gov

Disinfectants

Common Disinfectants Chemical Compound Gram + Bacteria Gram - Bacteria TB-like Bacteria Fungi Virus Best pH range for activity Activity when organic matter present Common uses ** Chlorhexidine SA* SA SA SA Most Wide range Good E/P/F Formaldehyde and aldehydes ++ ++ ++ ++ ++ Wide range Good...

www.vet.cornell.edu

Chytrid contact time is one minute.

Efficacy of common disinfectants and terbinafine in inactivating the growth of Batrachochytrium dendrobatidis in culture

 

[JasonE]

I respectfully disagree. Published contact times for general pathogen disinfection are typically 10 minutes.

Rationale and Considerations for Chlorine Use in Infection Control for Non- U.S. General Healthcare Settings | Non-U.S. General Healthcare Settings | Clinicians | Ebola (Ebola Virus Disease) | CDC

This page is a guidance document that describes basic recommendations on chlorine use for infection prevention and control, and is intended for Ebola healthcare workers in a non-U.S. general healthcare setting.

www.cdc.gov

Disinfectants

Common Disinfectants Chemical Compound Gram + Bacteria Gram - Bacteria TB-like Bacteria Fungi Virus Best pH range for activity Activity when organic matter present Common uses ** Chlorhexidine SA* SA SA SA Most Wide range Good E/P/F Formaldehyde and aldehydes ++ ++ ++ ++ ++ Wide range Good...

www.vet.cornell.edu

Chytrid contact time is one minute.

Efficacy of common disinfectants and terbinafine in inactivating the growth of Batrachochytrium dendrobatidis in culture

I had never heard that. I just spray down, wait a minute and then wipe it down and get to work. I guess I really only have to worry about molds, bacteria and other fungus spores, not viruses.

Just go with the isopropyl.

 

[Llehctim]

Thanks for the responses, looks like I'll go pick some isopropyl up and then get started on the more fun stuff!

 

[Llehctim]

What thickness of glass would I need to span the 36” for a custom piece on top? I plan on leaving maybe 4-5” or so for ventilation. I’d like a small piece at the back as well, so one ~36” by 10” and another ~36” by 4-5” . I like keeping the back a little humid as I find the climbing plants do a little better that way.

 

[Socratic Monologue]

Standard for aquarium tops of this length (typically supported on three sides) is 3/16". Having them tempered is, I think, very cheap insurance.

 

[Option3]

Make sure you water test before you start scaping, I doubt the previous owner would have done that with a snake!

 

[Socratic Monologue]

That's great advice. I just sold a leaking viv (with full disclosure of that fact, of course, and priced accordingly) at an expo. They're great cheap finds for folks who don't need it to be watertight, but I don't assume that they would necessarily pass the info along to a future owner.

 

[Llehctim]

Yes, of course after I cleaned it resealing was the next thing to do! I redo the whole bottom plus the corners a few inches up at the very least. But a good reminder anyway. There was some caulking that had been stripped away so it was easy to see that it had to be redone.
Still haven’t tested it but definitely will before the hard scape.

 

[Llehctim]

For those that use nicrew lights, which model do you use?

 

[fishingguy12345]

For those that use nicrew lights, which model do you use?

RGB plus or SkyLED plus are what I try to get.

 

[Llehctim]

RGB plus or SkyLED plus are what I try to get.

Is there any reason in particular you like those? This is just to help my learn more about lighting, not questioning your choice.

Also, while I'm waiting for corkbark to arrive, I've been thinking about the plants, and I've got some ideas. I was thinking of having most shingle plants, but also having one larger central terrestrial plant, something like the philodendron black cardinal (although that may be a bit too big), that has leaves that could one, support a terribilis without collapsing, two, grows more upwards to avoid taking away groundspace, and three, has darker leaves to provide some stunning contrast between the leaves and frogs. Any ideas?
I did pick up a philo black cardinal for cheap, although I don't think it will have enough aerial roots to take a top cutting from, and am not set on it so any other plant ideas would be welcome!

 

[fishingguy12345]

Is there any reason in particular you like those? This is just to help my learn more about lighting, not questioning your choice.

They let me adjust the colour of the lights more than the other models.

 

[Llehctim]

so, after a painfully long process I’ve secured some good sized cork pieces and going to start scaping the viv. I plan to try and get a lot of ledges with them. As well, there are a lot of small-medium flat rocks where I live, so I’ve grabbed a bunch and will add them to the upper reaches as additional ledges (at the top so the don’t fall on them)

I’ve got a bit of foam and silicon which I will use to secure the cork and rocks. I don’t think I will do the whole background with it, more strategic to enable lots of climbing area and places for shingling plants to climb, as the terribilis don’t really seem to hide at all, even in their current heavily planted tank. I’m planning to stick peat to the silicon. I know a lot use coco fiber or coir, but peat is super cheap for me (about the only thing that is, lol), so unless there is a problem with it (please tell me if there is), I’ll use it.

hope to post some pics of the scape soon.

 

[Llehctim]

So I ran out of silicon while doing the background... urgh. Don't think I will be doing foam background again. Seems like a lot of extra work and doesn't end up much cheaper by the time all the foam and enormous amounts of silicon is accounted for. I'm also not too impressed with Great Stuff. On my first tank I used a generic brand that seemed to adhere to the glass much better and also expand more. Fingers crossed the great stuff holds.

I did get some plants I order for this tank:
Pearcea hypocryptifola - the plant I got is quite small. Is keeping it in sphagnum a good way to grow it?

Begonia maynensis - help, this is my first begonia. I'm not usually a fan of begonias but I think this one looks fantastic. I've got it in sphagnum currently, but any tips on keeping it alive and thriving are appreciated.

Philodendron sp. Condor - this is one I'm super excited for. Tiny, deeply veined leaves. Currently trying to figure out how best to display this climber nearer to the front to display its leaves

Selaginella uncinata - hoping to grow this in a darker, little higher humidity corner. I'm hoping to make a moisture gradient with this area holding a little more humidity than the rest of the tank. I want to hopefully see which humidity/temperature levels the terribilis gravitate to.

Peperomia reptans - hoping to grow this one near the top up the background

I've also got philo micans, marcgravia rectiflora and umbaletta that I plan to grow up the background, and an alocasia bambino (it takes up hardly any 'floorspace') that I'm planning to add. This build will have a lot more climbing/shingling plants than my current one, in order to keep most of the ground leaf litter/hardscape.

 

[fishingguy12345]

Pearcea hypocryptifola - the plant I got is quite small. Is keeping it in sphagnum a good way to grow it?

It'll work that way. What I usually do is put the plant in sphag moss with soil underneath so that the plant can grow roots into the soil.

Begonia maynensis - help, this is my first begonia. I'm not usually a fan of begonias but I think this one looks fantastic. I've got it in sphagnum currently, but any tips on keeping it alive and thriving are appreciated.

See above.

 

[Llehctim]

Finished the hardscape! Sorry for the bad lighting, that room has a single bulb so it is difficult to get a good picture.
Will have to do a bit of cleaning up the glass and such, but overall fairly happy with it. I have a large half of cork round which will be on the ground in the middle, making it an easy jump to the inclined piece on the left. I do also have one other piece of cork I haven't used yet, still deciding if I should use it or refrain from making it too crowded.

Top view:

Left side:

Right side:

Close up on the rock wall:

I'm curious to see if they ever use the rock wall.
I also did more background than I initially planned. I figured because I have a lot of shingling plants I wanted the maximum area for them to climb.

 

[Llehctim]

Some updates:
All the components for ABG came in, spent a whole lot of time baking the components (the NZ tree fern fiber I got last time I think was the culprit for flower pot fungus, so hopefully can avoid that this time).

Bleach dipped and planted a bunch of plants

It looks so bare compared to my last one but heres to hoping it will fill out. Plants are selaginella uncinata, pep. serpens, philo sp. condor, philo micans, philo brazil, satin pothos, margravia rectiflora and umbelleta, and pearcea hypocryptifola.
The frogs currently love the large leafed philos, so I'm hoping the philos will climb up nicely and produce some big leaves.

I've also got plans to put in an alocasia bambino on the right (I thought the mother plant would produce off shoots by now but hasn't yet), and begonia maynensis on the left. Speaking of which it seems to have gone through a bit of a shock and dropped a leaf and a couple look a little crispy, but seems to have stabilized this past week. I was hoping to take a cutting from it, but is it large enough to do so? I'd rather have one hopefully happy plant than two unhappy ones, but if I can make two happy plants that would be awesome!
Here is a photo of it currently:

And once it has grown in sufficiently I'll be introducing these silly fellows to it.

There will of course be plenty of leaf litter added before the frogs go in, and some other seed pods and cooc huts.

Edit: Forgot to mention there is no tempered glass on the island, so I'm debating either ordering some in or just going with 1/4" glass for the top. Right now its just plastic wrap which I'm not a fan of, but hopefully it will do alright temporarily.