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Discussion Starter #1
Well, after a bit of thinking, I've decided to start up again with darts! My last experience with frogs do to my inexperience and impatience, but this time, I'm going to take it slow!
Right now, I have a vacant 20 gallon X-High sitting in my garage from my first viv.
Not to be confused with a 20 high, the tank has the same footprint as a ten gallon, and the height of two tens stacked on top of each other, making it's dimensions 20"x10"x24".
This is, IMO, inadequate housing for any terrestrial dart due to it's lack of floorspace.
Again, this is my opinion, and I would never house a frog like a tinc in a 10g or similar. What others do with their frogs is none of my business, and I'm not wanting to start another tank size argument.
My solution to this problem is to flip the tank horizontally. This would provide about 480 sq. inches of floorspace. To put this in perspective for you, a standard 20L has around 378 sq. in. of floorspace.
But I have a few questions about this.
So let's say my false bottom is 3". Now the frogs have just 7" of usable space. Add 2" of substrate. Now only 5".
I suppose I could make the FB shorter and use less substrate, but there isn't a lot of vertical space to begin with.
I'd probably be stocking it with a few auratus, so this might not be an issue as they are terrestrial frogs, but the question is how much vertical space do they need?
Another issue is practicality. I would be getting a 10 gallon hinged glass top from junglebox for a door, but when I open it, how can I prevent substrate and water from underneath the FB from spilling out everywhere? I suppose I could silicone a piece of acrylic to the bottom part of the opening, but would it interfere with the door?
Let me know what you think! Any insight would be appreciated! :)
-Matt
 

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Discussion Starter #2
I know I'm getting ahead of myself a little, but assuming that this idea works, I was thinking about putting the tank on a slight incline, and setting part of it up as a stream. It would be really shallow, and it wouldn't flow fast, so that area could still be navigable by the frogs, not taking up any floorspace.
 

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so it is going to be a 20 x-high vert to make it horizontal? +1 for innovation. Check out other vertical tank builds, and you will see that everybody silicones a piece of glass on the bottom to hold in the false bottom and substrate. I have not made a vertical (or horizontal in your case) conversion yet, so im really not much help here.

I say skip the water feature. Everybody wants to put them in their first viv, but they really don't do anything but complicate things and provide more room for error. I can't really tell you that you absolutely can not do it, but just consider it. If you feel you can successfully pull it off, then go ahead. Good luck man and keep us updated!
 

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Are tipping the tank on its side or back? Your math is wrong for the side as floor area.

It's correct for the back, however I doubt that is your plan with 3" of false bottom a few for substrate you'll be left with 5" or so of tank for plants.

Best of luck can't wait to see the viv.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
ryan10517 said:
so it is going to be a 20 x-high vert to make it horizontal? +1 for innovation. Check out other vertical tank builds, and you will see that everybody silicones a piece of glass on the bottom to hold in the false bottom and substrate. I have not made a vertical (or horizontal in your case) conversion yet, so im really not much help here.

I say skip the water feature. Everybody wants to put them in their first viv, but they really don't do anything but complicate things and provide more room for error. I can't really tell you that you absolutely can not do it, but just consider it. If you feel you can successfully pull it off, then go ahead. Good luck man and keep us updated!
Now that I think about it, a water feature might not be the best idea. The tank is still in the planning stage, so we'll see were it goes.

Are tipping the tank on its side or back? Your math is wrong for the side as floor area.

It's correct for the back, however I doubt that is your plan with 3" of false bottom a few for substrate you'll be left with 5" or so of tank for plants.

Best of luck can't wait to see the viv.
My plan is to flip it on it's back. As I mentioned in my original post, I know the lack of vertical space will be an issue. I can always find low-growing plants, but I'm wondering if the lack of vertical space will affect the frogs.
 

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First, is the vivarium your describing really two 10gal stacked on top of each other or is it one tank? If it's one tank and doesn't have tempered glass, I'd knock out the front pane and build my own door. What about thumbnail dart frogs? Seems they would love the space and height. If you go with you original plan maybe try sloping the land. Like the original plan with 5in. in the back to maybe 1-2in. in the front and make some little mounds or hills in between. Just some ideas but what ever you do definitely keep us updated and good luck!
 

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I have a tank of the same dimensions that I'm also setting up.

If I'm understanding how you explained it, then 5" in my opinion would not be enough vertical room. Using another tank would be the best bet.

I'd recommend saving it for some thumbnails or a different species that will take advantage of the height.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
It previously housed a pair of imis, and they did enjoy the height, but this time around I was thinking about getting some auratus, which are terrestrial.
After some thought, I've decided to put the tank away for a future project, and stop by petco today and get a 30g.
Thanks for all the input!
 

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As a more practical issue, think about how space you will have to access the tank to do maintenance. You'll have the lower pane to hold in the substrate and you should have some kind of vent on the upper part for at least a little air circulation. Usually the vents have to be at least 2-3 inches wide if you are using the screening materials. So we have probably 4-6 inches taken off the ten inch opening leaving about five inches in which you have to be able to access the far side of the tank and clean the glass. Having done aquarium and terrarium servicing through those sorts of openings it gets old really quick.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
As a more practical issue, think about how space you will have to access the tank to do maintenance. You'll have the lower pane to hold in the substrate and you should have some kind of vent on the upper part for at least a little air circulation. Usually the vents have to be at least 2-3 inches wide if you are using the screening materials. So we have probably 4-6 inches taken off the ten inch opening leaving about five inches in which you have to be able to access the far side of the tank and clean the glass. Having done aquarium and terrarium servicing through those sorts of openings it gets old really quick.
Thanks for the input, Ed. You bring up some issues I didn't think of.
Looks like the tank is staying where it is. :)
 
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