How big is too big? - Dendroboard
Dendroboard

Go Back   Dendroboard > Vivariums > Parts & Construction
Register Blogs FAQ Calendar Mark Forums Read Advertise

Support Our Sponsors
No Threads to Display.

facebook

Like Tree1Likes
  • 1 Post By jgragg

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 06-10-2019, 07:50 PM
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Cleveland, OH
Posts: 47
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default How big is too big?

I've had a 75gal with 6 leucs for about 4 years now. My wife had been pretty indifferent about the frogs, but since moving it from the basement to the living room she is starting to really appreciate the mini ecosystem with breeding darts.

She would like somthing bigger to fill most of a wall, horizontal and vertical. Maybe 6'x6'x2' deep or somthing bigger.

Is there a point where 6 leucs will have too much room that negatively affects husbandry? Are there any commercial aquarium sizes that are large in both dimensions? I know 120gal are popular for fish, but I'm looking for somthing tall as well.
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 06-11-2019, 12:44 AM
SoloSK71's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Posts: 206
Thanks: 0
Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts
Default Re: How big is too big?

Coast to Coast Aquariums

They may be able to help you. At that size though, built on site is a better plan if you have a local builder.

Solo
__________________
0.0.0 D. tinc Azureus
0.1.0 Velociraptor sp. micro furry purring
0.1.0 Amazing spouse
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 06-11-2019, 03:03 AM
rmingers's Avatar
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Indiana
Posts: 23
Thanks: 5
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Default Re: How big is too big?

https://www.dendroboard.com/forum/me...-my-first.html

Take a look at this monster if you haven't already. I consider it to be the standard to which all our vivariums are judged.
Reply With Quote
 
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 06-11-2019, 02:03 PM
Encyclia's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Colorado, USA
Posts: 1,836
Thanks: 110
Thanked 203 Times in 189 Posts
Default Re: How big is too big?

I can't imagine there being any size tank that would be too big for the frogs when compared to the density they occur in the wild. They find each other in the wild, I don't think you need to worry about them finding each other in any tank we are likely to be able to build.

An important thing to remember in a tank the size you are talking about is access. It can be really difficult to get at all the places in a tank that size. There are lots of ways to plan around that, but before sure that it figures prominently your thinking.

Finally, you probably know this, but for anybody else thinking about this sort of thing, the budget tends to skyrocket when you are talking about this size build. There are numerous technical challenges and all of them will require an expensive solution in terms of time, money, or both.

Best of luck!

Mark
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 06-11-2019, 05:11 PM
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 34
Thanks: 1
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Default

Although the frogs have way more space in the wild and the density of frogs is less in the wild, yes there is a point where there is too much space in captivity. The reason for this is diet. You are likely providing supplement dusted fruit flies. When you add flies to a very large enclosure, it will take a spread out population of frogs longer to find them all. This gives the flies more time to clean off the supplements. 100 flies into 10 gallons is 10 flies per gallon. Into 100 gallons there’s only one fly per gallon and so the frogs have to move around more to get them all. The frogs will fill up on undulated flies between feedings. You will have to monitor more closely that each frog is getting enough dusted flies. Feeding stations help.
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 06-11-2019, 05:20 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 333
Thanks: 0
Thanked 41 Times in 40 Posts
Default Re: How big is too big?

Quote:
An important thing to remember in a tank the size you are talking about is access.
This bears repeating. Access, and also ergonomics. I don't like to have to stoop down, get on a ladder, or get my knee (or more of myself) into a viv. So having the top of the substrate about thigh or hip high, and the lights about eye height, and the depth no more than arm length, set the outer bounds on what I will build.

Then of course there's decorating - don't stick a bunch of branches or vines up near the front so you can't get behind them, etc. And I always preach bulkheads and sumps, and that's largely about access to filter media, pumps etc.

Quote:
There are numerous technical challenges and all of them will require an expensive solution in terms of time, money, or both.
I have found this true in the height dimension. Getting water way up, and light way down, can get expensive. My "outer bounds" gives a viv interior height of about 3 feet, which in all seriousness is plenty. (You think you need more, get yourself a greenhouse OK? ha ha) I wouldn't go beyond about 2' deep either. But length? Hey, whatever you like, man. Just make sure you can get it in and out of the house. It will, some day, need to leave the house - rest assured of this.

Good luck!
Encyclia likes this.
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 06-11-2019, 05:35 PM
Encyclia's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Colorado, USA
Posts: 1,836
Thanks: 110
Thanked 203 Times in 189 Posts
Default Re: How big is too big?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Awesome View Post
Although the frogs have way more space in the wild and the density of frogs is less in the wild, yes there is a point where there is too much space in captivity. The reason for this is diet. You are likely providing supplement dusted fruit flies. When you add flies to a very large enclosure, it will take a spread out population of frogs longer to find them all. This gives the flies more time to clean off the supplements. 100 flies into 10 gallons is 10 flies per gallon. Into 100 gallons there’s only one fly per gallon and so the frogs have to move around more to get them all. The frogs will fill up on undulated flies between feedings. You will have to monitor more closely that each frog is getting enough dusted flies. Feeding stations help.
While true, you can manage this with behavior. As you mentioned, feeding stations could help, but may not even be necessary if you feed at the same time in the same location. The frogs will get used to being in that area when the flies go in. You are right, though, that in a really big enclosure, any flies that escape the initial feed will not contribute much in the way of supplementation.

Mark
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT. The time now is 08:42 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.