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Old 02-03-2019, 07:36 PM
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Default Lighting through glass question

Hello Everyone. I just bought a Fluval 3.0 for my Paludarium build. My tank is a 54 gallon Bowfront and it has the glass lid to go with. My question is, in a Paludarium set-up, do the plants and animals get the benefit of full spectrum light through that glass lid, or should I be making an alternate set-up for that so that the light can shine down directly(i.e. through a screen)? Thanks in advance for any and all advice.

Mike
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Old 02-03-2019, 08:10 PM
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Default Re: Lighting through glass question

The glass is fine.
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Old 02-03-2019, 09:01 PM
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Default Re: Lighting through glass question

Yep - no worries about glass.
Some use low iron glass, but talking only 1/4" glass thickness max, and the express of low iron, the juice isn't worth the squeeze. (especially if you're drilling it for mister bulkheads like I did)
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Old 02-03-2019, 10:05 PM
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Default Re: Lighting through glass question

Awesome! Thank you both for the replies. One less thing I have to do
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Old 02-03-2019, 11:10 PM
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Default Re: Lighting through glass question

Both hp192 and JimM are correct, though if you intend to provide UVB, that will not penetrate glass. Likely this is not a concern for you, but I thought it would be worth pointing out, since you haven't specified what animals you'll be keeping.
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Old 02-04-2019, 12:26 AM
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Default Re: Lighting through glass question

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Originally Posted by Socratic Monologue View Post
Both hp192 and JimM are correct, though if you intend to provide UVB, that will not penetrate glass. Likely this is not a concern for you, but I thought it would be worth pointing out, since you haven't specified what animals you'll be keeping.
I do have a section at the rear of my tank where the glass runs out. There I intend to screen in somehow as I will be keeping Anoles in this tank on the top section. There I will need to get a UVB bulb for the basking section I am assuming? Also assuming you would want UVB to not shine through glass so the lizards get the heat?
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Old 02-04-2019, 12:31 AM
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Default Re: Lighting through glass question

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There I will need to get a UVB bulb for the basking section I am assuming? Also assuming you would want UVB to not shine through glass so the lizards get the heat?
UVB and heat are two different things.

Heat you know about; UVB is the part of the lighting spectrum just below (i.e. shorter wavelengths than) visible light. UVB is what many herps need in order to manufacture Vit D, which they in turn need to metabolize calcium. Anoles need UVB.

You don't want to shine a UVB lamp through glass, since the glass will block the UVB from penetrating into the viv. You don't want to shine a heat lamp through glass, since the heat will likely break the glass (plate glass doesn't tolerate much in the way of localised hot spots; those areas expand and stress the glass. So, both heat lamps (incandescent, usually) and UVB lamps (florescent, usually), should be above screen.
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Last edited by Socratic Monologue; 02-04-2019 at 12:33 AM. Reason: punctuation
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Old 02-04-2019, 01:47 AM
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Default Re: Lighting through glass question

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UVB and heat are two different things.

Heat you know about; UVB is the part of the lighting spectrum just below (i.e. shorter wavelengths than) visible light. UVB is what many herps need in order to manufacture Vit D, which they in turn need to metabolize calcium. Anoles need UVB.

You don't want to shine a UVB lamp through glass, since the glass will block the UVB from penetrating into the viv. You don't want to shine a heat lamp through glass, since the heat will likely break the glass (plate glass doesn't tolerate much in the way of localised hot spots; those areas expand and stress the glass. So, both heat lamps (incandescent, usually) and UVB lamps (florescent, usually), should be above screen.
OK That is much appreciated! Thank you. I wasn't sure how the "Full Spectrum" Fluval 3.0 was in relation to UVB and Heat. So in addition to my LED light, I'm also going to need maybe one of the Zoomed dual fixture Heat/UVB lamps. Thanks for clearing that up for me. I am new to the hobby and trying to get as much info packed into my brain as possible.
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Old 02-04-2019, 03:24 AM
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Default Re: Lighting through glass question

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I wasn't sure how the "Full Spectrum" Fluval 3.0 was in relation to UVB and Heat.
An LED fixture like that should give little heat, and will emit zero UVB.

You may find the tank you're using a bit challenging to keep anoles in, mostly because it will likely be difficult to fit all the various kinds of lighting on top. (Picking all the drowned crickets out of the water feature will be an issue too...) Hopefully you'll find a way to make it work.
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Old 02-04-2019, 05:55 AM
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Default Re: Lighting through glass question

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An LED fixture like that should give little heat, and will emit zero UVB.

You may find the tank you're using a bit challenging to keep anoles in, mostly because it will likely be difficult to fit all the various kinds of lighting on top. (Picking all the drowned crickets out of the water feature will be an issue too...) Hopefully you'll find a way to make it work.
I've been trying to post a photo of my tank but cannot get that to work. I've been agonizing over what to put on the land portion of the tank. I thought maybe Anoles due to their ease for beginners and the fact that they can swim(there is a lot of access to get out of the water). I know frogs are out due to the 7-8" depth of the water though. Any suggestions as to inhabitants in a set-up like this? Endler guppies and shrimp will be in the water portion.
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Old 02-04-2019, 03:43 PM
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Default Re: Lighting through glass question

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I've been agonizing over what to put on the land portion of the tank. I thought maybe Anoles due to their ease for beginners
Anoles are easy for beginners? I wouldn't have guessed. The internet has some funny opinions, maybe.

I keep an anole for scenting feeders for lizard-eating snakes, and it a lot of trouble and equipment and electricity and live food for a $6 lizard I can't even hold.

You don't have to put any animals in there. Lots of folks have displays with only plants; such displays can be very enjoyable and rewarding and beautiful. You might consider just learning the ropes without the extra layer of complexity of an animal (that seems to be mostly a space filler, anyway) for a few months or more. You sound as if you feel obligated to get an animal, and that's not a great reason to get one.
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Old 02-04-2019, 03:53 PM
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Default Re: Lighting through glass question

Instructions for attaching photos are here:

https://www.dendroboard.com/forum/fa...b3_attachments
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Old 02-08-2019, 12:33 AM
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Mossy frogs would be perfectly at home in the tank you describe minus the heat lamp. 7-8 inches of water is fine as long as you have plenty of driftwood, rocks, background, aka places where they can crawl out. Mine are in 6 inches of water with white clouds and red cherry shrimp. Don't be put off by the price of mossy frogs, well worth it in my opinion and avid feeders on crickets and earthworms. Mostly nocturnal but mine will feed when the lights are on.
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Old 02-13-2019, 10:51 PM
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Default Re: Lighting through glass question

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Anoles are easy for beginners?
Yeah I was pretty shocked at that too. While they are cheap, they are not "easy". I mean, sure, once you've got a good set-up for them to live in, and you've got a good food supply etc, sure, they're easy enough. But...they sure aren't a "beginner lizard". And they don't really belong in an aquarium with a glass lid. They'd do better in a chameleon screen cage - they're not so very different from chameleons in terms of care...

My advice is forget anything that needs UV for its metabolism. Dr Manhattan offers some fine ideas, consider going that route.

Quote:
I keep an anole for scenting feeders for lizard-eating snakes
What about using feeder brown anoles? Just curious.

cheers
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Old 02-14-2019, 01:08 AM
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What about using feeder brown anoles? Just curious.
cheers
People do buy quantities of brown anoles and either feed them live or freeze them. I think that's a pretty good use for an invasive species, but I haven't gotten desperate enough to want to feed any of my snakes anything live collected (yes, I realize there's a risk in simply scenting using a WC anole). I also keep a CB Sceloporus for the same purpose, and if I have a hatchling snake that holds out for a whole lizard, I have a good supply of CB mourning geckos and Coleonyx that I can draw from.

Raising mountain kingsnakes is a pain...
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Old 02-15-2019, 12:56 AM
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Default Re: Lighting through glass question

Quote:
Raising mountain kingsnakes is a pain...
Oh, indeed. Pyro, zonata, what's your poison?

I have no aversion to feeding snakes wild-caught food. I used to. I got softer with age and have discovered that for the most part, I was formerly managing a problem that didn't exist. It's liberating, and simplifies logistics, and can be cheaper if you don't spend a bunch of gas money going out to collect scelops or whatever.

I also think lizards make a fine diet for animals that mainly eat lizards, either as juveniles or for their entire lives. They maintain growth and weight just fine but seem less vulnerable to obesity. Kind of a white bread / whole wheat thing, maybe? Ha ha.

Anyway - just sharing. It's a free country, if what you're doing turns your crank and you can make it work - hey, rock on!
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Old 02-15-2019, 01:00 AM
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Default Re: Lighting through glass question

Knoblochi are my original and still favorites. I'm starting to get attracted to alterna, though; picked up a nice female Langtry and will likely get her a male next fall.

Attached is a pic of one of my breeder knobs.
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Old 02-15-2019, 05:00 PM
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Default Re: Lighting through glass question

Ah, very good. I've just kept a few pyros and they aren't bad from a mouse vs lizard perspective. Zonata apparently are much worse; hardly anyone seems to keep those any more. Alterna have a pretty bad rep as stubborn lizard-lovers. I imagine knobs are middle of the road, for switching to pinks?

I've never kept alterna but aesthetically I prefer the basic "original" (1980s) Langtry-region animals, I never came to like the busy X-mas Mtns look that got popular about 10 years ago. My faves are the super dark-greys (almost black) with narrow orange bands. I'm actually going to that area in May for a week or two, on a field herping trip. Good times!

Nowadays I spend a fair bit of field time trying to document new pyro localities. That's when I pick up most of my juniper pieces for vivs. Some friends here have local wild-caught pyros. A common solution is to just keep them on the lizards they want anyway - so no need to breed mice, buy mice, worry about mouse bites, worry about the food value of frozen-thaweds, etc etc etc. Just catch healthy right-size lizards when they're available (spring-summer), and when they aren't, well, the snakes are either refusing food (fall) or hibernating anyway! "Going with the flow", ha ha. Easy peasy. They relish a bit fat fence lizard - some wild ones hanging out in a rock crack will take one right out of your hand. "Hell yeah I'll hit that!" Ha ha ha. That's pretty fun actually, hand-feeding a wild snake.

Anyway, sorry OP for the hijack. I hope you've found your path forward, you got some good advice here.

cheers
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