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-   Oophaga (https://www.dendroboard.com/forum/oophaga/)
-   -   Minimum space? (https://www.dendroboard.com/forum/oophaga/95861-minimum-space.html)

Nismo95 05-14-2013 08:47 PM

Minimum space?
 
I am a firm believer in bigger is better with all our frogs.. But currently am limited to space and starting our first rack.. I am curious to see some input from more experienced Oophaga breeders on the site and see what they have to say about this... Would a trio suffice in a 20H vert? Or do some think thats too small? Just weighing options..

frogparty 05-14-2013 08:55 PM

Re: Minimum space?
 
overall space is less important than how you design said space.

That being said, I think a 20 vert is fine, BUT you will need to constantly add microfauna in the form of springtails to keep the in tank population from crashing

Also, you want to make sure there are adequate deposition sites, hiding areas and calling areas to choose from, not just one that may be less than optimal

Really, I think youd be better served by an 18x18x24, but it can definitely work




Nismo95 05-14-2013 08:57 PM

Re: Minimum space?
 
Totally agree with the less space issue more design issue. If I could do a rack of exo's I would do the 18x18x24's.. But space is limited and frogs are abundant and itching to get out of QT bins.. So 20H verts will have to suffice for the time being until we sign off on our own home and I get to be manly and rebuild a frog room. lol.

Buddysfrogs 05-14-2013 09:11 PM

A 20 high should work. Just make sure you fill it with wood vines plants etc.
Buddy
PS. We better see pictures of it completed.

Nismo95 05-14-2013 09:17 PM

Re: Minimum space?
 
No worries lol. Once everything is finished there will be plenty of pictures. First rack and 6 new vivs.. You better believe there will be a photo shoot. Lol

Dizzle21 05-14-2013 09:42 PM

Re: Minimum space?
 
I use 18 verts. just slightly thinner than a 20g.
Heres a pic on how its set up. Lots of broms and leaf litter!
http://i433.photobucket.com/albums/q...pse9a2dfbf.jpg

Nismo95 05-14-2013 09:49 PM

Re: Minimum space?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dizzle21 (Post 846163)
I use 18 verts. just slightly thinner than a 20g.
Heres a pic on how its set up. Lots of broms and leaf litter!
http://i433.photobucket.com/albums/q...pse9a2dfbf.jpg

Yeah, but do you keep pairs or trio's? What species. thanks!

Dizzle21 05-14-2013 10:11 PM

Oh duh. I keep pumilio pairs and have a 1.3 cauchero that are doing great in a 18

Nismo95 05-14-2013 10:26 PM

Re: Minimum space?
 
Very cool. Glad to see someone is having luck with it. I was starting to worry a little. I wont lie. haha

Nismo95 05-15-2013 04:00 PM

Re: Minimum space?
 
I like how 2 people chose option #3 just to spite me. lol. They could of chose #2 and been fine but chose #3 and didnt bother to explain why. lol. Sad times people. Sad times..

cbreon 05-15-2013 07:22 PM

Re: Minimum space?
 
I chose #3, but not to spite you, just to offer an explaination. I think the smallest you want for most pumilio groups would be 18x18x24 as some others have mentioned. However, a 20h could work for smaller pums like the escudos, sc's, ryans, some popa, etc...

I always think of the beta fish in a tiny little cup. Can it live in that cup, sure if you are careful with the water and make sure to clean it. But would it be happier in a bigger bowl? I don't think there is any doubt about it.

Dane 05-15-2013 07:30 PM

Re: Minimum space?
 
A well planned 20H vert should be fine for 1.2 trios of just about any pumilio. I haven't used them specifically for my frogs, but I have had good experiences with 10g verts and pumilio trios. The only problems occurred when I moved the established, aforementioned frogs to larger enclosures.

mydumname 05-15-2013 08:39 PM

Re: Minimum space?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dane (Post 846382)
The only problems occurred when I moved the established, aforementioned frogs to larger enclosures.

What kind of problems occurred?

Nismo95 05-15-2013 08:43 PM

Re: Minimum space?
 
Thanks for the input cbreon and Dane.. I am a bit surprised you kept a trio in a 10g vert! Would be too paranoid to do that. Lol

Dane 05-15-2013 09:03 PM

Re: Minimum space?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by mydumname (Post 846402)
What kind of problems occurred?

Greg,
in both instances the frogs lost weight, lost color, and died. They had been given previously clean fecals and PCR, and all substrates/plants/decor were sanitized before use. I think the complete change of scenery was a bit much, and there may have been underlying issues that I was somehow not aware of. If I had it to do over again, I would have started with larger tanks, and never moved the frogs.
I ultimately vote for 18g or 20g extra tall tanks for pumilio, if you can find them. They take up the width of a 10 vert, but double the substrate area.

Dane 05-15-2013 09:06 PM

Re: Minimum space?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Nismo95 (Post 846403)
Thanks for the input cbreon and Dane.. I am a bit surprised you kept a trio in a 10g vert! Would be too paranoid to do that. Lol

This was a year or two before the "bigger is better" trend began, and the tanks were virtually 100% useable area, thanks to greatstuff, pothos, and wandering jew.

Nismo95 05-15-2013 09:07 PM

Re: Minimum space?
 
Good to know. I am trying to keep things within budget as far as the initial viv purchase. I have. 48x18x72 inch rack and can fit 3 of the 20's on there. If there was another option I'd go a different route.. And if someone wants to buy a fully finished 36x18x36 exo with lights and stand let me know.. It would fund some custom vivs so I can skip aquarium verts to brom with haha

Dave II 05-16-2013 04:19 AM

Re: Minimum space?
 
I think 18x18x24 is a good minimum size.


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