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Old 05-21-2020, 01:04 PM
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Default Looking to get back into the hobby after a 15 year hiatus

Hey everyone. As the title states I’m looking to get back into the hobby. Last time I had any darts was about 15 years ago. I’ve owned and bred plenty of other creatures but for the past few years have only had the doggos and up until about 2 years ago reef tanks. Now I have a 2 year old son and daughter due next month and would love to have them grow up enjoying having mini rainforests to look at. No matter all the different animals I’ve had, nothing compares to frogs imo. They’re just my favorite for many reasons.
I’ve got a couple build ideas in mind, but being away from the hobby so long there’s so much to catch up on. I’ll make a separate post in another category with my
Ideas and hope to get some feedback.
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Old 05-21-2020, 01:28 PM
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Default Re: Looking to get back into the hobby after a 15 year hiatus

Welcome back ! What species are you thinking about for frogs?
What did you used to keep?
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Old 05-21-2020, 01:58 PM
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Some definite oh my list are Azureus as they were always a favorite and terribilis. Either mint or orange most likely. In the past I had a few different Auratus, powder blue tincs, and a couple other tincs. Rite now my biggest challenge is what size tanks I can set up. Once some more renovations are complete I can put some racks and larger setups (eyeballing the insitu Amazonia). But to get started I have a space on my kitchen that desperately needs a setup on the counter top. My issue is the height. I have just under 20” clearance between the counter and the bottom of the cabinet. So the standard 18” high exo terra can fit, but I worry about that less than 2” gap being insufficient for ventilation and equipment like lights on top. Not sure how great the 12” high exoterra would work out
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Old 05-21-2020, 02:40 PM
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Default Re: Looking to get back into the hobby after a 15 year hiatus

Welcome to DB!

Not to be a buzzkill, but a herp enclosure on a kitchen counter is, from a zoonotic pathogen standpoint, extraordinarily unwise. Especially with children in the house.

Frogs (like most animals we invite into our homes) carry salmonella, and have been linked to outbreaks in the US. Turtles linked to salmonella outbreaks led to the <4" turtle ban enacted in the 1970s. More illnesses linked to herps will lead to more restrictive laws enacted against herp keepers. Salmonella is a reportable illness in the US, so if your kids go to the doctor with symptoms, eyebrows will be raised at the county and state level.

Children under 5 are the most susceptible age group; infants with salmonella are in a particularly dangerous situation, since they require antibiotics and are very susceptible to secondary dehydration.

Escapes of fruit flies from vivs are the norm, sometimes in great numbers. FFs spreading pathogens (both from frogs as well as ubiquitous soil-borne pathogens) on kitchen surfaces, into foodstuffs, etc is a very bad situation.
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I think I could turn and live with animals, they are so placid and self-contain'd.

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Old 05-21-2020, 02:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Socratic Monologue View Post
Welcome to DB!

Not to be a buzzkill, but a herp enclosure on a kitchen counter is, from a zoonotic pathogen standpoint, extraordinarily unwise. Especially with children in the house.

Frogs (like most animals we invite into our homes) carry salmonella, and have been linked to outbreaks in the US. Turtles linked to salmonella outbreaks led to the <4" turtle ban enacted in the 1970s. More illnesses linked to herps will lead to more restrictive laws enacted against herp keepers. Salmonella is a reportable illness in the US, so if your kids go to the doctor with symptoms, eyebrows will be raised at the county and state level.

Children under 5 are the most susceptible age group; infants with salmonella are in a particularly dangerous situation, since they require antibiotics and are very susceptible to secondary dehydration.

Escapes of fruit flies from vivs are the norm, sometimes in great numbers. FFs spreading pathogens (both from frogs as well as ubiquitous soil-borne pathogens) on kitchen surfaces, into foodstuffs, etc is a very bad situation.
No worries. Not a buzzkill at all. I kind of thought it wasn’t a great choice, so was considering a freshwater shrimp colony in that spot, but then figured I could fruit fly proof pretty well and put a trap nearby for any escapees. But never considered the salmonella aspect of this. Would salmonella still pose a risk if it were in a different area young kids frequent like the living room? Or am I best off to just keep all frogs in a separate room until the kids are older?
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Old 05-22-2020, 02:08 AM
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Default Re: Looking to get back into the hobby after a 15 year hiatus

Well, you have to eat contaminated stuff to contract salmonella. Yeah, kids put everything in their mouths, but having the source of pathogens somewhere other than the kitchen would reduce risk. Drying kills pathogens pretty well too, and the rest of the house is drier than strawberries on the counter, or a bottle of formula left out to cool for a minute, or... you get the idea. When I mentioned ubiquitous soil pathogens, I thought of infant botulism, too. One of those 'low probability, high consequence' situations where the lower I can get the probability, the better I feel.

Teaching kids about cleanliness around animals is good in any event ("Hey, champ, you found a fruit fly -- good job! Don't eat it!"), and not having animals in the kitchen is a good lesson.
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I think I could turn and live with animals, they are so placid and self-contain'd.

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Old 05-22-2020, 03:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Socratic Monologue View Post
Well, you have to eat contaminated stuff to contract salmonella. Yeah, kids put everything in their mouths, but having the source of pathogens somewhere other than the kitchen would reduce risk. Drying kills pathogens pretty well too, and the rest of the house is drier than strawberries on the counter, or a bottle of formula left out to cool for a minute, or... you get the idea. When I mentioned ubiquitous soil pathogens, I thought of infant botulism, too. One of those 'low probability, high consequence' situations where the lower I can get the probability, the better I feel.

Teaching kids about cleanliness around animals is good in any event ("Hey, champ, you found a fruit fly -- good job! Don't eat it!"), and not having animals in the kitchen is a good lesson. <img src="http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/images/smilies/smile.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Smile" class="inlineimg" />
All valid points. I have a extra bedroom I was going to use as a office so it’s inevitable that I’ll have a rack within weeks of just setting up 1 tank again. So why delay, may as well start a frog room/office
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Old 05-23-2020, 05:12 AM
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Default Re: Looking to get back into the hobby after a 15 year hiatus

Me too! Well 9 years...
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