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Old 07-25-2008, 10:58 PM
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Default Live Oak Leave sterilization

I think people just sterilize them by baking them. That is what I read here online. But will they burn? I mean, I have not come across many temps. or length of time. I have a bag full of them I collected in North Carolina and need to sterilize them good when I get home, many bugs and all.
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Old 07-26-2008, 12:16 AM
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Default Re: Live Oak Leave sterilization

I got a box of them from a friend and I boiled them for half an hour in a pot and than I baked them at 350 just long enough for them to get some of the moisture back off (I forget, maybe about 20m)...
I never remember what is suggested and I really don't recall seeing temps or times but they shouldn't catch on fire if they are boiled first? Mine didn't anyway. Hopefully someone else will pop up and mention.

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Originally Posted by MonopolyBag
I think people just sterilize them by baking them. That is what I read here online. But will they burn? I mean, I have not come across many temps. or length of time. I have a bag full of them I collected in North Carolina and need to sterilize them good when I get home, many bugs and all.
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Old 07-26-2008, 01:40 AM
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Default Re: Live Oak Leave sterilization

They don't catch on fire. Just get nice and crunchy.
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Old 07-26-2008, 01:44 AM
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Default Re: Live Oak Leave sterilization

I just use stack them in large cake pans and put in @ 225-250 for about 20-30 minutes. I do both my oak and magnolia leaves this way. I just make sure that the leaves collected are pesticide and herbicide free.
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Old 07-26-2008, 02:10 AM
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Default Re: Live Oak Leave sterilization

Do the leaves need to be from fall, dropped by the tree or can you pick green ones and dry those? All my leaves are alive but Im going to need some for my newly finished viv.
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Old 07-26-2008, 02:40 AM
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Default Re: Live Oak Leave sterilization

Why not just let them dry out throughly?

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Old 07-26-2008, 05:30 AM
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Default Re: Live Oak Leave sterilization

Oops, I think I meant 250. Sorry

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Originally Posted by pet-teez
I got a box of them from a friend and I boiled them for half an hour in a pot and than I baked them at 350 just long enough for them to get some of the moisture back off (I forget, maybe about 20m)...
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Old 07-26-2008, 01:50 PM
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Default Re: Live Oak Leave sterilization

So I'll ask it again. Why not simply dry air dry them throughly? What do you think you are removing by these somewhat elaborate "sterilization" methods?

Ed
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Old 07-26-2008, 11:55 PM
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Default Re: Live Oak Leave sterilization

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed
So I'll ask it again. Why not simply dry air dry them throughly? What do you think you are removing by these somewhat elaborate "sterilization" methods?

Ed
I think what they are trying to do by cooking them in the oven or boiling them is to kill any nasties that might not be good for their frogs. I dont think drying is the main/only objective. I just pulled a piece of drift wood out of a 300 degree oven. I picked it up at a beach today and want to make sure Im not going to introduce any harmful stuff into my viv.

Of course, Im a noobe, so take what I say with a grain of salt! :shock:
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Old 07-27-2008, 04:57 AM
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Default Re: Live Oak Leave sterilization

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed
So I'll ask it again. Why not simply dry air dry them throughly? What do you think you are removing by these somewhat elaborate "sterilization" methods?

Ed
Hey Ed!! after all these years, we are of one mind! Or perhaps we always have been, from different perspectives.

In the first place, what are a bunch of dried-off oak leaves going to introduce to your frogs in the way of frog pathogens? Nothing that will harm them in any way. And there is a great deal of difference between "sterilizing" and just "sanitizing" what you collect and use. You can't "sterilize" in the sense that you will kill everything off, without ruining the purpose of introducing oak leaves in the first place. You want the little microbial organisms they harbor, as well as the tiny insects that may feed your frogs and harbor the springtails, tiny molds and such these will eat. You want to establish a living environment, not a dead one. Otherwise, you might as well use plastic plants and raise snakes. (Whoops, I may be in trouble here--I adore snakes, I just prefer frogs for a smallish biological recycling vivarium.)
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Old 07-27-2008, 08:13 AM
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Default Re: Live Oak Leave sterilization

Quote:
Originally Posted by slaytonp
In the first place, what are a bunch of dried-off oak leaves going to introduce to your frogs in the way of frog pathogens?
I boil mine in case there are snail or slug eggs that would harm plants. Then again thouroughly drying would seem to meet the same goal. But as a by-byproduct I get tadpole tea.
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Old 07-27-2008, 01:42 PM
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Default Re: Live Oak Leave sterilization

Quote:
Originally Posted by hobbyuniverse
I just pulled a piece of drift wood out of a 300 degree oven. I picked it up at a beach today and want to make sure Im not going to introduce any harmful stuff into my viv.
Personally, I would worry about potentially adding significant amounts of salts to the vivarium. I don't know how close to the beach the piece of wood was located and for how long or if it was previously submerged in the ocean, but I would think boiling and/or soaking it for extended periods with regular water changes would help to remove potential salts (salts: there could be more than just NaCl), though maybe not entirely. I would definitely worry if there is any 'crusty' or whitish material on it, but salts could be inside the wood too.

Just thinking out loud.

Mike
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Old 07-27-2008, 10:47 PM
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Default Re: Live Oak Leave sterilization

These sterilization processes change the structural composition of the leaves causing them to breakdown more quickly which removes some of the benefits of the microhabitats that they supply. A sufficient period of simple drying will remove most of the major concerns of pathogens without the consequences of the increased decomposition rates.
Boiled leaves are good for some of the tadpoles as they will graze on them and you can as noted above get tadpole tea but thier structure and ability to provide microhabitats has been to some extent compromised...

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Old 07-28-2008, 12:21 AM
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Default Re: Live Oak Leave sterilization

Quote:
Originally Posted by roxrgneiss
Quote:
Originally Posted by hobbyuniverse
I just pulled a piece of drift wood out of a 300 degree oven. I picked it up at a beach today and want to make sure Im not going to introduce any harmful stuff into my viv.
Personally, I would worry about potentially adding significant amounts of salts to the vivarium. I don't know how close to the beach the piece of wood was located and for how long or if it was previously submerged in the ocean, but I would think boiling and/or soaking it for extended periods with regular water changes would help to remove potential salts
Actually I live on the shores of Lake Erie, which is fresh water. You make a good point that if it was salt water there might be some concern. Regardless, thanks for the heads up. Im still fairly new to this so I dont mind having someone watch my back.
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Old 07-28-2008, 12:55 AM
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Default Re: Live Oak Leave sterilization

Quote:
Originally Posted by hobbyuniverse
Quote:
Originally Posted by roxrgneiss
Quote:
Originally Posted by hobbyuniverse
I just pulled a piece of drift wood out of a 300 degree oven. I picked it up at a beach today and want to make sure Im not going to introduce any harmful stuff into my viv.
Personally, I would worry about potentially adding significant amounts of salts to the vivarium. I don't know how close to the beach the piece of wood was located and for how long or if it was previously submerged in the ocean, but I would think boiling and/or soaking it for extended periods with regular water changes would help to remove potential salts
Actually I live on the shores of Lake Erie, which is fresh water. You make a good point that if it was salt water there might be some concern. Regardless, thanks for the heads up. Im still fairly new to this so I dont mind having someone watch my back.

I definitely misinterpreted... :roll: Glad to hear the wood is salt free! Or at least only has very small amounts..

Mike
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Old 07-30-2008, 06:29 AM
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Default Re: Live Oak Leave sterilization

THANK YOU ALL! So I think I do not plan to sterilize or "sterilize" should I say, my leaves, I agree one hundred percent. Thanks again. I really like the breaking down speed input. Kudos to you Ed.
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Old 08-03-2008, 04:03 AM
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Default Re: Live Oak Leave sterilization

From what my friends in Ohio tell me, if your frogs can survive driftwood collected from Lake Erie, they can probably also function with depleted uranium, mustard gas, and a myriad of other things. They swore the reason they never got dysentery or any of the other dozens of diseases making the rounds in Iraq was because after swimming in Lake Erie, they were immune to everything.

Couldn't help myself, I had to poke a little fun.
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Old 08-03-2008, 11:33 AM
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Default Re: Live Oak Leave sterilization

Quote:
Originally Posted by DocChris
From what my friends in Ohio tell me, if your frogs can survive driftwood collected from Lake Erie, they can probably also function with depleted uranium, mustard gas, and a myriad of other things. They swore the reason they never got dysentery or any of the other dozens of diseases making the rounds in Iraq was because after swimming in Lake Erie, they were immune to everything.

Couldn't help myself, I had to poke a little fun.
That is very funny and sadly a bit true. Unfortunately all the manufacturing industry in the area wasnt always held to the highest standards when it came to disposing of waste in the lake. Its better now but still not great. Big brother now watches over them but Im sure it will be a while, if ever, when the lake wont have a bunch of stuff us humans discarded.

My goal with the tainted driftwood is to have some of the uranium soak in to the frogs skin to give them the ability to glow in the dark. That way if one ever escapes I will just shut out the lights making it much easier to spot it! :shock:
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