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Old 06-03-2012, 04:20 PM
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Default Your thoughts on community raising tads

I'm considering turning a 10 gallon tank I have laying around into a tad rearing tank. My concerns are:

Will the tads eat each other?
Do they give off a growth inhibiting hormone to make other tads not grow?
Would it be a really bad idea to raise tads from different clutches/of different sizes in the same tank?

I'd have some duckweed, indian almond leaf, java moss, and philodendron in the tank. I like to keep my tads in "dirty" water since they seem happiest that way.

Does anyone currently raise their tads this way? TIA!

Also, I'm about to set up a 56 gallon column tank for my breeding pair (they are in a 29 gallon right now which will become my froglet grow out tank) and I'm considering giving them a "puddle" to self raise their tads in. I was planning to have it be a water fall feature with a small pool. Does anyone else have a set up with something like that? Thoughts?
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Old 06-03-2012, 04:55 PM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

Check out this very popular thread about tad tanks...

http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/bre...le-setups.html

It may not specifically talk about community set ups, but it will get you lots of options and (of course) lots of opinions. Some of it is related to community and shared water set ups.
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Old 06-03-2012, 05:30 PM
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Id stay away from communally raising tads. I tried it with a clutch of bakhuis tincs and the growth rate is significantly between the group. I stick with individual cups now. Its more work, but id rather have healthy frogs.
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Old 06-03-2012, 07:00 PM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

Most phyllobates (Vittatus, Terribillis ... etc) can be raised communally with no ill effects.
E.Tricolor & E.Anthonyi can too.

Im sure there are others, but i cant name them off of the top of my head.
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Old 06-03-2012, 07:05 PM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

What species are you considering to raise that way.Some species will work some will not.

Lou
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Old 06-03-2012, 09:13 PM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

It all depends on the species involved. Dendrobates, Ranitomeya, and Oophaga prefer to be by themselves while Phyllobates, Epipedobates and Ameerga are communal tads.

The first three have interesting traits that help them deal with small bodies of water and competition including hormonally limiting growth (Dendrobates specifically - this is why shared water set ups require lots of water changes for good growth) to territorial behavior (higher densities making the results of this more extreme including losing toes, feet, and parts of tails) to even being full on cannibals. Raised in ideal densities there are often few side affects other than maybe taking longer to morph (and the increased room leads to grazing that can mean larger tads as well as ideal water quality without the stress of water changes), but that takes up MUCH more space than individually raised tads in 16oz cups where everyone morphs around the same time and with good care can be just as big. These guys have smaller clutches, and even with clutches of multiple tadpoles may only carry 1 or 2 at a time to drop them off. The tads will often hold on until they are in a body of water where there is not a tadpole already present. These guys are evolved to handle very small bodies of water with highly limited resources - particularly food. They don't share well because it's life and death for all involved.

The communal raisers have much larger clutches which tend to have the whole gang pile on all at one time (covering the parent up to the eyeballs with a good clutch!) and are drop off in larger bodies of water like road side ditches, small ponds that don't contain fish and may be seasonal, and still or slow water pools next to streams (created by high water). I raise these guys in shoe boxes or larger and sort for size regularly. You can keep it simple by doing regular partial to full water changes to remove frog poo to really highly complex with sumps and live plants to try and make a system where you don't influence it much besides adding/removing tads and feeding them (but only controlled amounts since the system can only handle so much, and will provide a lot of food as well). Usually I go intermediate with a sponge filter, partial water changes to get out some of the tad poo, lots of grazing materials like leaves, some floating plants in the tank for water scrubbing, and I keep an eye on the water quality. Even when I use a 10 gallon I do not fill it all the way up, and at max have it 2/3 full as I fell it is too deep otherwise.

Specifically what you mentioned (that I haven't hit already):
- I always sort for size, and usually start with one clutch per tank. Usually they grow at about the same rate when stocked appropriately so there shouldn't be much sorting unless you've got overstocking issues or nutrition issues (due to parents) which is resulting in weaker tads.
- There are better plants you could be using. I keep it to a couple of nice easily handled floaters like frogbit or red root floaters. Duckweed gets everywhere and can make maintaining the tank hard, and while there is a LOT of them they are not cleaning your water as well as something with a larger root system. Some of the tads also like to nibble the roots of the larger floaters, and I've noticed that I can't keep ANY small floater like duckweed or azolla in with Phyllobates - they will eat it all. Java moss will end up pissing you off because all the dirty stuff will gather in it (UGH) so I no longer use it in any of my aquatic amphibian tanks... I also tended to have tads and salamanders tangle in it and other mosses. I don't bother with any terrestrials like the philodendron since they don't have the cleaning power of the floaters, and any grazing surface they provide can be given by other means. I do, however, stuff froglet tanks with them, particularly with the Epipedobates that like sitting on the leaves while being near water.
- Indian almond or any tannin source (oak, beech, alder cones, pine needles, etc) I "brew" outside the tank (5g bucket with an air stone, add hot water when adding new water to the bucket) to keep the water quality consistent. It is a PAIN to have your water juuuuuust right, add some leaves and then have it get way too acidic, or the leaves you used this time leeched too fast and now the water is weak, etc. The tads are hardy and can handle a lot, but to make water changes easier I scrapped it. After the leaves have leeched tannins until they are floppy in the bucket they are added to tad containers (individual and group) to provide sheltering spots and grazing area for food. They also happen to be very nicely covered by bacteria slime at this point When the leaves start falling apart whatever is left gets removed and tossed in the compost pile. Sooooo much easier to clean when the moss is not involved!
- Puddle in the tank... if you have a breeding pair of Dendrobates/Ranitomeya/Oophaga, they are looking for lots of little sources of water hidden away. Dendrobates like bigger ones than the others, and are usually looking for something holding 8oz+ of water, like half a coconut or a monkey pod or something (the small egg feeders will use film canisters and the like down to about 1oz minimum, but this is WAY too small for Dendrobates). If this is Ameerga/Phyllobates/Epipedobates that pond needs to be multiple gallons... preferably more than 5g open water if you want them to completely raise in tank (and that's probably only part of one clutch that would be able to do it at a time). Less than that and you'll be pulling every tad you can catch to try and raise it in another tank. I actually trick these guys into using a temporary pond that I can remove and replace so I don't have to chase all the tads.
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Old 06-05-2012, 02:31 PM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

Sorry, I somehow forgot to mention that I have a giant pair of cobalts which produce MASSIVE tadpoles. I'm gonna keep my idea for a small pond in my new 56 gallon column set up (I just ordered some frogbit last night), but I guess I'll keep pulling any eggs they lay under the hut and cup raising till they are about to morph out. Thanks so much!
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Old 06-07-2012, 01:50 AM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

I always include a pond even if they won't use it for that reason Always gives them a source of water, and since mine are just dug out sections of my drainage layer it means easy water changes if needed, or pulling out the extra water if I spray too much
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Old 06-07-2012, 01:55 AM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

I am actually using a 10 gallon as a rearing tank for luec tadpoles. I put tadpole tea in with oak leaves and java moss. The tads seem to stay pretty clear from each other and they are all growing equally fast. This could change if too many tads were put into the tank though.
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Old 06-07-2012, 02:00 AM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

Yeah it would probably change pretty quick LOL. They probably are showing signs of little territories as well As long as they aren't too crowded they shouldn't nip and cause damage to each other.
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Old 06-07-2012, 02:05 AM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

You are correct KeroKero. They have distinct areas in the tank and they dont move into each others areas. I would be afraid to put any more into the tank without causing major problems.
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Old 06-07-2012, 02:07 AM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

I remember seeing it first with Azureus... a little circle where they'd hang out and give others the death glare if they got close.... "My spot... MY SPOT! MINE!" LOL
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Old 06-07-2012, 03:11 AM
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That is definite! LOL! I will keep my fingers crossed and hope they all morph out without any scars or hurt feelings! ha-ha
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Old 06-07-2012, 07:32 AM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

Check out this guy's setup and experience about 3/4 of the way down the page:

Tamamizu.frogroom.html
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Old 06-07-2012, 11:32 PM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

I would stay away from community tads the bigger ones tend to take over and end up killing off the little ones.
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Old 06-08-2012, 01:11 PM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

The only time I've had outright killing of tads has been with some of the carnivorous/cannibalistic Ranitomeya (vents... I'm looking at you!), but tadpole deaths and aggression will happen with Dendrobates when over stocked. You'll usually see signs before that though if you've been slowly adding tadpoles... nipped tails when young escalating to nipped toes in older tads with developing limbs. These are usually the ones without established territories which you can just pull if you're keeping an eye on things and notice it's never really staying in one spot. In a tank full of territorial tads the newbies tend to get the short end of the stick being smaller and beaten up every time they turn around - these are the ones at risk of dying from stress and lack of food. In communal set ups - no matter the species - you should always be keeping an eye on the individual tads to check for aggression, size, weight, etc., and sorting as needed.

Don't go by volume of the tank, you'll want to have a shallow tray/container with the largest floor space you can get for a communal set up. The larger the floor plan, the more territories they will hold (the ones in the link were 90x60x22 cm - 35.4x23.6x8.7in to give you an idea of the sizes we're talking about here). I've had some great experiences with communal tads (a lot of the success comes from having more grazing food available and more stable water quality) but the space it takes to do these territorial tads is massive compared to the 16oz containers where you don't have to worry about density issues... but may have to do a little more work. Those same containers mentioned before could hold many multiples the amount of tads for communal species like Epipedobates, Phyllobates, and Ameerga.

I good experiment would be to try a half sweater to full sweater box sized container and see how it works for you.
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Old 07-06-2012, 12:18 AM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

I'm still not getting email notifications! Grr!!!

I tried a communal set up, but my first tad didn't get out of the water and died. :'( He was my favorite. He was very healthy and all his legs were well formed, but I think the set up threw him off. I only had 4 in a 10 gallon and they didn't seem to bother each other, but I'm back to deli cups for now. It was a learning experience. I have a tad that should be coming out of the water today or tomorrow. I'm worried about him not getting out too so I keep staring at him and I think I'm making him nervous. Lol!
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Old 07-06-2012, 02:21 AM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

Yeah, tell me about it :/ I have been getting them spotty, and even had no notifications for a few weeks just to have all the missing ones come at once! Not sure what's up with that, or if it's a known glitch.

Making sure they can get out of the water does seem to be a hard part... I make sure there is something all around the edges for them, as well as a floating island. Easiest way for me to do this was having floating bits of java and cork, and keeping the sponge filter in the middle... it will push all floating stuff to the sides of the tank because of the air bubbles. Moss is a pain to keep clean, but while I love to use leaf litter in the tank as well the leaves will stop floating after a while! If you use cork try and use the thinnest pieces you can so that the edge of the top will dip into the water, making it easy to climb on. If the piece is too thick then the edge of the top will be up out of the water and they won't be able to climb on it! If this is the case drape the edges with some java moss (part in the water, part up the cork). The moss will love you and take over the cork raft LOL.
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Old 07-06-2012, 03:41 AM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

I'm setting up a 56 gallon column tank (look for a thread later! ;P) right now and I'm adding a pool/waterfall part so hopefully they'll be able to get out of it ok. I'm going to make a rock "ladder" for them to climb out on.
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Old 07-06-2012, 03:37 PM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

Just remember if you have any corners in the water area you'll probably want to put a rock or something there for swimming frogs to sit on. PDFs aren't horrid swimmers but can tire easily, especially if they get into a corner and keep swimming against glass! Even if it's not a 90 degree angle corner you may want to put a little "rest spot" there. I've found that rougher textured rocks work better for me than the smooth river rocks do - these guys don't have particularly helpful toepads for wet rocks and don't come from areas when they have to deal with them much. They are puddle breeders! Using semi-aquatic mosses in and around the rocks has helped a lot too for froglets, it's the ultimate in helpful climbing. I keep it mowed down pretty well to keep it from taking over (and filling the pond) but that's about it.

Even in a 56g you're going to have too issues... your pond likely isn't going to be big enough to hold many tadpoles, and tincs aren't pond breeders. They may drop a few tads in the pond but after a while the tadpoles won't let go of their parent's back and go in the water since they will be able to sense that there are already tadpoles there. For cobalts I'd recommend tossing in stuff like the water holding pods/bowls that BJ has. I've done it for other Dendrobates and it's really fun to check the pods and see what you find! Then when they get overloaded you can just pull them and raise them from there, and give the parents new spots to stash tads for you to find When I offered my D. truncatus a little bit of running water, a pond, and a slew of pods for tads they really liked the pods!
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Old 07-07-2012, 07:55 AM
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I've been wanting to get pods from BJ for a while, but only one kind is available ATM and I want some diversity. I don't mind pulling eggs and I don't really expect them to use the water feature, but hubby has been asking about a waterfall since I got into the hobby a few years ago. I just got out of the saltwater hobby so I kind of miss a water feature, but I'm also not thrilled about the maintenance I'm going to have to do. I'm trying to decide if just having a small waterfall will be enough filtration/aeration or if I actually need a filter of some kind. I like the 0 maintenance of the 29 gallon my breeding pair are in right now, but I think a water feature would look nice if I do it well (which, with a 4 month old baby and hubby deployed, it's becoming very hard to get any progress done on the tank at all, let alone creating a waterfall). The background is 75% done, but I haven't started on the water feature other than siliconing a glass partition to the bottom of the tank. I'm sitting on the fence about adding it at all. :/
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Old 07-07-2012, 05:41 PM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

If you let the water have access to the drainage layer, and it's something like gravel or LECA then you've got a lot of filtration right there! Makes it easy to do water changes that involve the drainage layer too. Once the tank is established you'll be surprised at how good the water quality can be. I do occasional water changes and that's about it - no filter. Don't use a solid separation between land and water because you're losing a HUGE benefit of the tank with the bioload in the drainage layer and the additional water down there making the water in the tank actually larger so it's a larger body of water to have changes in (so less likely to have crazy swings). Also, plants get their roots down there on the land side and start pulling nutrients out of the water too. It's a pretty good passive filter! All you do is make sure the drainage layer is deeper than the highest you ever want the pond to be, and leave at least another half inch to an inch (the more the better) before the bottom of the substrate starts (passive filter idea works best with you have a loose substrate drainage layer rather than a false bottom which just acts as a reservoir, no filter media). I typically use rocks and maybe mix in some driftwood to make the natural coastline. With waterfalls especially it's nice to use stacks of slate and what not If you use a fine mesh (no-see-m fine mesh is better than fiberglass, more flexible) to separate the drainage and substrate layers you can then drape it behind the rocks to keep tadpoles from getting into the drainage layer. If you use stacked rocks like slate chunks (there are handy ones for designer set ups - you can use them like steps) you can have two layers and sandwich the mesh between them. If you just have one layer of rocks then put the mesh down and then lay the rocks on it the way you want, then pour your loose drainage in behind it, lay the mesh down on top, and add substrate. Presto!

A waterfall can be a fine thing if you can keep debris out of intake (I pull it through a small sponge filter intake which I pull and rinse as part of regular maintenance) and set it up so that you can easily get to the intake and outtake as needed. I put mesh over the outtake as well to keep frogs out of it, so the pump needs to be powerful to get around all that. All stuff you can easily handle after the fish hobby!

I've found that the intake with a dark sponge isn't as obvious when you've got leaf litter and what not in the pond The only time I've used something like a turtle filter was because it was easier for me to have the intake and output where I wanted them (and with sponges/mesh) than trying to get one of those little pumps to work the way I wanted (because the intake is often on the box and you can't exactly use a sponge filter thing around it). I've also used powerheads as well - attach them to pipes with foam on the end and you can pull water from a completely different part of the tank.
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Old 07-07-2012, 09:32 PM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

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Originally Posted by KeroKero View Post
If you let the water have access to the drainage layer, and it's something like gravel or LECA then you've got a lot of filtration right there! Makes it easy to do water changes that involve the drainage layer too. Once the tank is established you'll be surprised at how good the water quality can be. I do occasional water changes and that's about it - no filter. Don't use a solid separation between land and water because you're losing a HUGE benefit of the tank with the bioload in the drainage layer and the additional water down there making the water in the tank actually larger so it's a larger body of water to have changes in (so less likely to have crazy swings). Also, plants get their roots down there on the land side and start pulling nutrients out of the water too. It's a pretty good passive filter! All you do is make sure the drainage layer is deeper than the highest you ever want the pond to be, and leave at least another half inch to an inch (the more the better) before the bottom of the substrate starts (passive filter idea works best with you have a loose substrate drainage layer rather than a false bottom which just acts as a reservoir, no filter media). I typically use rocks and maybe mix in some driftwood to make the natural coastline. With waterfalls especially it's nice to use stacks of slate and what not If you use a fine mesh (no-see-m fine mesh is better than fiberglass, more flexible) to separate the drainage and substrate layers you can then drape it behind the rocks to keep tadpoles from getting into the drainage layer. If you use stacked rocks like slate chunks (there are handy ones for designer set ups - you can use them like steps) you can have two layers and sandwich the mesh between them. If you just have one layer of rocks then put the mesh down and then lay the rocks on it the way you want, then pour your loose drainage in behind it, lay the mesh down on top, and add substrate. Presto!

A waterfall can be a fine thing if you can keep debris out of intake (I pull it through a small sponge filter intake which I pull and rinse as part of regular maintenance) and set it up so that you can easily get to the intake and outtake as needed. I put mesh over the outtake as well to keep frogs out of it, so the pump needs to be powerful to get around all that. All stuff you can easily handle after the fish hobby!

I've found that the intake with a dark sponge isn't as obvious when you've got leaf litter and what not in the pond The only time I've used something like a turtle filter was because it was easier for me to have the intake and output where I wanted them (and with sponges/mesh) than trying to get one of those little pumps to work the way I wanted (because the intake is often on the box and you can't exactly use a sponge filter thing around it). I've also used powerheads as well - attach them to pipes with foam on the end and you can pull water from a completely different part of the tank.
The rocks I have are from Rose Beach here in WA and are all flat and smooth so they will work just like slate, but be prettier IMO. Do you know somewhere to get a very large piece of substrate foam? I would use LECA like my other tank, but that stuff isn't cheap and would run me at least $50 to get the amount I need for this tank. (Probably more since I would need at least 5-6 bags). Thanks for steering me in the right direction! I've been procrastinating with the pond area because I knew it wasn't turning out how I want.

I bought a bunch of pods from BJ today because I saw my male frog transporting a tadpole with no where to put it! Normally I pull the eggs, but I didn't know they had laid any. I gave him a dish of water and he dropped off the tad, and then snapped at it with his tongue. I hope they don't become egg eaters... There were 4 other eggs/tadpoles (not quite hatched yet) on the petri dish so I pulled them and will be putting them in cups when they completely hatch. I'm so glad to know that my frogs are actually great parents and will self raise! They have definitely run out of room in the 29 and I think they'll love the upgrade and more space. The female took a dip in the dish before the male dropped off the tad so I think they'll also like the MistKing and a small pond. I also have quite a few broms to go in the tank (they have none right now) so maybe they'll use them too. The 29 is going to become my frogglet grow out tank. The one tad/frogglet still hasn't gotten out of the water but he still has a tail and is very active so I'm not too worried.
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Old 07-09-2012, 02:53 AM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

You should always keep them in different cups and never mix the tadpoles togather..
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Old 07-09-2012, 11:23 PM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

Froggirl - it's more complicated than that which makes it a little confusing to say that. It's more of a "best practice" not to mix them and to raise Dendrobates in particular separately but there is no hard rule about it - even in the wild. The tadpoles prefer it, they will take steps to prevent it if possible (ie - not letting go of the parent when introduced to the water if they sense competition), and there are even some biological systems in place to try and make it work (ie - hormones suspending growth of all but the dominant tad). What you have to keep in mind:

- There is a maximum amount of Dendrobates tads you can put in a container. They form territories and as long as everyone has one they won't have much aggression or have to fight for food. Pass that threshold and you've got competition for food and aggression which can lead to tail nipping, and even the lose of toes and feet. Doesn't matter how clean the water is or how deep it is, if there isn't enough room in the floor plan there will be issues.
- Multiple animals in one body of water will result in one animal growing great while the other animals have their growth inhibited but with no side affects... since tadpole raising spots are typically the population limitation and food isn't super rare it's worth getting as many tadpoles to live - in contrast to more cannibalistic Ranitomeya where tadpole raising spots are both rare and have a severe lack of food (so the new tadpole BECOMES food!). If all the Dendrobates tadpoles were all growing at once they may run out of both food and space, but one growing at a time won't push that limit.
- a 16 to 32oz container popular with tadpole raising will often have the same footprint size, just hold more water due to height. Tadpole territories work on footprint, not height. You want to add more tadpoles, try using a shoebox instead so you have a large footprint. Add a new tad to a 32oz FF container and you'll have the original one defending it's territory... same amount of water in a container with a larger footprint (salad container, shoebox, etc), you'll likely just have a bicker and then they will set up two different territories
- Breeders prefer to raise the largest amount of tads the fastest they can with the least complications. These also tend to be major sources of info on raising tads, so it has become the "standard" way to do it but isn't the only way.

My naturalistic way of doing this in a display tank where mom and pops do the work is just to have a ton of those different pods! I actually like to use the same type in one tank (but will use different pods in different tanks, I like each tank to visually have it's own "personality") as I feel it's more natural to me. The way I think of it is that those frogs are taking advantage of a tree that's been dropping a lot of pods at it's base and you'll tend to have a LOT concentrated in one area. I'll jumble the leaf little a bit, but it's like rainforest giant acorns - when those things fall they make it very easy to tell where that tree is they are coming from!

You're lucky to have natural stone to use! Mine tend to be chunks of various metamorphic rocks... a little bit harder to work with but I've learned to use a lot of different sizes to stuff in between the larger rocks to get the right "look", and the screening behind the rocks keeps any drainage stuff where I want.

I haven't used substrate foam as a drainage layer before. I don't particularly like it for that because I feel that it displaces too much water so I end up lowering the reservoir capacity too much. If LECA is too expensive (I buy 40L bags for $50 from hydroponic supply stores) then using large aquarium gravel can work too - you can get similar stone from stone supply places. Just make sure it's a metamorphic rock and that the size of the gravel is at least the same size as LECA or larger... smaller gravel like pea gravel starts getting you into the same issue as the foam. River rock may be a bit on the large size but honestly... if it works then who cares? It's just going to be heavy. Another light weight and CHEAP alternative is styrofoam peanuts! Don't get the biodegradable ones and set up your tank DRY. The stuff will float like crazy so you need to have everything set up to keep it in place before adding water. Set up your pond rocks, fill in the reservoir drainage area with the peanuts, put the mesh down, add the substrate (pre-moisten it so it's just right and doesn't need to be watered), plant, then add water to the pond and let it fill the drainage layer to the level you want. Usually the substrate is plenty heavy to hold it down if you're using a deep enough layer I always include at least a little drainage pond so frogs always have water and I have a way to pull out extra water when I over water!

I wouldn't be too worried about them being egg eaters, if they eat eggs it's for a reason. I think the movement just got him a little hyper about food!

I don't have any tincs that have actively preferred broms over laying on other huts or on land... really it's the D. leucomelas that prefer elevated horizontal leaves to the point they lay on broms more than in huts in some cases... but it's not brom specific, they will lay on a lot of horizontal leaves given the option! Who knows, your tincs may like them though, otherwise they are at least pretty Dendros seem to prefer broms with leaves at least as wide as they are which is why I think tincs don't lay on them as much, they are too big and not always the best climbers LOL.
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Old 07-10-2012, 12:22 AM
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Another light weight and CHEAP alternative is styrofoam peanuts! Don't get the biodegradable ones and set up your tank DRY.
You aren't concerned about the whole endocrine disruption thingy?
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Old 07-10-2012, 03:13 AM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

Dammit, everything is toxic now isn't it :/

I'm going to pull a bit from a different thread I just looked up... "...there are differences in leachates between different formulations of the plastic and ingredients used in those formulations. Polystyrene is used in multiple applications and formulations and not all are the same and not all are much of a risk for leachates. ... for example, polystyrene is used to make plastic petri dishes which are resistant to leachates in multiple formulations. "

http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/beg...yrofoam-3.html

Basically... I have no idea what level of safety it is. Egg crating is made from a similar product and used all the time. I even use PVC piping in a number of my fish and tadpole set ups. Best I can say is I'm not well versed in it, can't say what is safe, and honestly using any sort of man-made plastic type stuff has a risk. I use LECA and gravel so I don't have any long term experience either, I was just trying to offer options
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Old 07-10-2012, 06:56 AM
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I found foam at Joann Fabrics that is used for seat cushions that I'm 98% sure is open cell reticulated polystyrene foam like others are using. It's green and looks like it's 20 PPI, but it might be 30 PPI. Now I need to figure out how to wash it to make sure it's froggy safe. I ended up buying 3 things of pods from BJ. It says it's a 3 pack, but the description says the pack contains 5 various sizes so IDK if I'm getting 15 or 9. We'll see. I had my first froglet ever get out of the water today. He's SOOOOOOOOOOOO cute! I put a bunch of springtails in his tank and I'll see if he's interested in FFs tomorrow.

On a side note,
Does anyone know a really good way to get silicone off glass? I'm using a razor blade to remove it from some areas I put it and then changed the design, but I sliced my fingers with the side of the blade (the non-sharpened part. I have NO idea how I managed that!), but it's not going as fast as I'd like or as thoroughly as I want.

I'll be sticking with the 1 tad per cup method for now since it's what's working for me, but I would be thrilled if the frogs used the pond area as a nursery.
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Old 07-10-2012, 05:09 PM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

Sounds like the stuff I've used as fish filters LOL. I imagine the same guidelines for making it fish safe would work here.

I think the description may have originally been pulled from one of the other pods which they sold in packs of 5 and they just missed that part! I imagine the title is the correct one. Some people use black silicone on the inside of them to make them last longer.

Froglet wise... I usually let them have at springtails for the first week until they start really getting up and actively hunting. At that point I'll offer them wingless. These guys will still spend a few days absorbing their tails and using that for energy so they don't need to be fed right away, and the springtails are a low pressure way to make sure food is available.

I've always had to use the flat blades in a handle thing built to hold them or they kill my fingers! The flat blades are usually replacement parts for those tools. The blades aren't really meant to be used just by themselves so they don't do much to make them not cut you since that's what the handle is for!

I'm more interested in seeing if they prefer the pond or the pods! Every time I found tads from my truncatus in the pond it turned out most of the pods were full LOL - but that could be their preference.
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Old 07-10-2012, 09:46 PM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

Baby frog has spent the day just chillin in one spot (he shifts around every now and then, so I know he's still alive). I'm assuming that's him just absorbing his tail and saving his energy.

How would you go about making it fish safe? I was going to rinse, rinse, rinse, rinse and maybe do a vinegar rinse, but it's a pain in the butt to do that much rinsing.
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Old 07-11-2012, 08:23 PM
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No idea really. I've only bought filter foam from fish people that just had to be rinsed before use... I don't have good instructions beyond that
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Old 07-12-2012, 06:48 AM
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Default Re: Your thoughts on community raising tads

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No idea really. I've only bought filter foam from fish people that just had to be rinsed before use... I don't have good instructions beyond that
I couldn't find a decently priced piece of fish foam. I hope this works. I'm pretty sure it will.
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