Large Vivarium Construction

[Jellyman]

You can make a flase bottom in the same mannor as you would a plenum for a saltwater sandbed.

[fraser2009]

wow man so many ideas come to mind with this
what kinda say you gona get ? i would be extra carful with what you get for the frogs as rays can be very touchy with alot of chemicals so id be really worried about leaching.
also how you planning to keep the frogs on land. if one happens to venture onto water that ray will be on it in no time which could be very bad for both partys.
that salt tank was amazing have you thought of converting those stacks to tree trunks that would be stunning create a big chunk of the forrest floor.
good luck with this and take as many pics as you can then take 10 more

[rmelancon]

To answer a few questions, the purpose for a false bottom is to provide a drainage layer so that the upper layer, be it straight sphagnum, soil, etc. does not stay constantly soaked. Things that are constantly soaked tend to rot, breed bacteria, etc. A false bottom or layer of leca (or volcanic rock as you have suggested) all serve the same purpose of keeping your top layer from sitting is water. It is my opinion that many hobbyists keep their tanks way too wet and with the volume of this tank you will probably want some ventilation and air movement to keep your plants and frogs healthy. The other thing you will need to consider with a tank of this size is that your subtrate will break down over time regardless of what you choose and you will need to add fresh layers over time. The broken down material will collect at the bottom of the tank and outside of a complete breakdown of the tank they will just stay there. Due to the size you are not going to want to break the entire thing down very often if at all. If you go with straight sphagnum, it will last a couple of years and what I do is remove the live moss that grows on top of it, any plants etc., lay down a fresh layer and put the moss and plants back on top of it. The mix you were referencing will last longer. You may also want to consider leaf litter on top of the substrate you mentioned. I don't know if that tank has drains on the bottom or not, but I would not want water stagnating in something that large. I'm assuming you are going to have some type of moving water, just make sure you don't have areas where large volumes of water can stagnate. You'll also need to figure out an escape proof top, which will be interesting.
Hope this helps and looking forward to see what you come up with.

Robb

[Energy]

Thank you for the thorough explanation and comparison of the advantages toward each substance.

The water section will have a small water fall and an outside sump to filter and monitor the water quality in the lake or lagoon area. The depth of the water section will be approx 8-10" and be 5' x 5'. Not very deep but a large surface area appropriate for a stingray.

No seperation will be needed between the stingray and the frogs. Stingrays can be trained to eat specific foods and will ignore other items outside of what they have been taught- very similar in a way a falconer trains a hunting bird (hawk etc) to go grab a rabbit and bring it back to the trainer instead of eating it right there where they caught it. With a regular schedule and specific foods offered they learn quickly where and when to go to get fed.

The bottom of the terrarium will be approximately 1-2" above the water level (At it's lowest point) of the lake and slope up toward the back of the tank in a "hill".

I will either set up a misting system or realistically a humidifer on a timer to keep the tanks land section self watered.

I do not plan on doing a tank tear down to replace the soil that is why I am choosing carefully. Furthermore if it becomes an absolute neccesity to perform this in the future I am hoping the weed barrier will be a great way to grab and lift out large sections at a time.

The volcanic rock will fill in the void to keep the soil sections elevated. I have the coir or coco fiber and fir bark or orchid bark ready and will mix this with a free draining preferably washed sand and will use that sand for the bottom of the water section as well.

A large section of the tank will simply be riccia for ground cover with a well planted back wall and other interesting features. I have had a 150 gallon palarium once before and it got taken over by large leafed plants quickly. To the point where nothing was visible. I will avoid using these in the system (NO POTHOS) and prefer small leaved slower growing plants for the back drop.

Ventalation: This is the next challenge. I do not want to constantly wipe off 15' of acrylic to see what is going on inside. I am thinking some fans aimed at the front glass set up on a timer to go on in the morning and after any misting occurs.

Approximately half or more of the top of this tank is covered by braces. In fact I only have 4 openings in the top for access. So basically I need to create 4 screened access covers to keep everything in. That should be doable.

[Jellyman]

Originally Posted by Energy

Approximately half or more of the top of this tank is covered by braces. In fact I only have 4 openings in the top for access. So basically I need to create 4 screened access covers to keep everything in. That should be doable.

My glass tank has a eurobrace and I went to the local hardware store and had them make me 3 screen sections that lay on the eurobrace to prevent any escapees. I then took 1/8" plexi(the thin stuff at Lowe's or HD) and laid it on top of the screens. Then over the course of a few weeks I drilled holes in the plexi until I reached a good balance of humidity within the tank in combination with fans to reduce/eliminate condensation on the front of the enclosure. My fans run most of the day and are off during the night.

[Energy]

I am thinking about setting up a bank of fans aimed at the front glass similar to a defroster in a car. Something easy but effective.

Here's a complicated idea: I have been thinking about replicating a thunder and lightning storm inside the tank but without the actual electrical bolts.

What I would like to do is automate a storm by having the lights dim, a thunder/rain soundtrack start and somehow get bright light flashes to randomly occur as the thunder soundtrack plays. During this I might have a misting system start a rainstorm inside the tank. This would be down the road quite a ways but I always like to plan and weigh options. Does anyone have any advice or links to something similar?

[jubjub47]

It seems like a strobe light would give the type of flash you want, but you would have to figure out how to slow it down and make it a bit more random.

[Energy]

Yeah that's a good idea, have a strobe light turn on and off with a timer that can go down to seconds instead of minutes. This would do lighting bursts.

[Jason]

One thing to keep in mind is that if you use cocofiber you will more than likely stain the water to the point that viewing your ray may be difficult. You may want to divide the water/land feature and keep it completely separate that way you can adjust the water parameters much easier.

If you don't feel like doing that I would go with a false bottom (egg crate) and forget the lava rock. My reasoning for this is to allow for more water in the tank so parameters of the water for the ray can't change as rapidly and it would keep it more stable. This would also allow for the staining from the cocofiber to the water to be minimal. It would also allow you to move the water under the false bottom and detritus debris will not build up between the rocks.

As far as substrate I would use a variety of stuff since you have so much room. Atlanta Botanical Gardens mix is always awesome.

ABG mix
2 parts fine fir bark
2 parts fine tree fern fiber
2 parts milled sphagnum moss
1 part fine charcoal
1 part peat moss

You should also try maybe an area of clay based substrate.

This thread will teach you a lot about it!

The ultimate clay-based substrate thread

Pro's Choice Products

[earthfrog]

I really think the hydroton is superior to the lava rock even though it is more expensive since it absorbs water and leaves optimal air gaps due to its spherical shape. It's not as visually pleasing, though, so you could do a facade of lava rock in the front of the tank and fill in w/hydroton behind that.