Observations on Tadpole Growth "Warning Long Post"
The following is some of my observations for the reasoning behind why some tadpoles have a better growth rate than others.
These are observations from my own experience and from comparing notes with other breeders.
It has been stated that if two tadpoles of the same species are kept in identical sized containers and feeding regimes, the tadpole that is maintained with a larger volume of water, develops at a greater rate and complete metamorphasis with a larger body mass.
I do not believe it is solely the greater volume of water, which contributes this growth rate. Due to the larger volume of water, the total amount of surface area, beneath the water surface is exposed to the tadpole.
This larger surface area allows more algae growth and also beneficial bacteria. This gives the tadpole an additional food source as well as increased natural filtration in the water.
I have also noted that tadpoles will more readily eat the algae growth on the side of the container, than introduced (dried) algae.
To confirm this, I have started to place containers of water under a strong light to encourage algae growth. I then place several small strips of glass or food grade plastic (50mm x 80mm) in these containers. Once these have developed a film of algae growth, they are then placed in the tadpole-rearing container. I cycle these freshly grown algae plates with the ones the tadpoles have grazed on.
Some species seem to have a better mortality rate if, the container in which the tadpoles are raised have some live plant material (e.g. java mass) and an old dried leaf.
The Live plant assists in the filtration of the water. The dried leaf will form base on which beneficial bacteria can colonise. These bacteria colonies are also an additional food source.
The tadpoles also benefit by having some place to hide, thus reducing stress.
Some species (e.g. Epipdibates) deposit their tadpoles in bodies of water that have a daily rate of exchange, i.e. small slow moving streams. If the tadpoles of these species are kept in larger containers with sufficient depth and slight water movement, their development in increased over those that are not.
This movement of the water has some effects:
1. Removal of old or stagnant water.
2. Removal or dispersal of growth inhibiting pheromones given of by siblings.
3. Increasing the water/oxygen level, due to increased exposure of water to the air.
Water movement can be is easiest to achieve when using a small filter or the outlet from a filter.
By increasing the feeding of a varied diet for the tadpoles, will naturally also increase the rate of pollution of the water in the tadpole rearing containers.
This will require increased water changes or water filtration.
I would like anybodies comments and their own observations. :wink:
I meant to reply to this when it was posted but have been busy so I came back to it... Odd that no one else responded...
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I do not believe it is solely the greater volume of water, which contributes this growth rate. Due to the larger volume of water, the total amount of surface area, beneath the water surface is exposed to the tadpole.
This larger surface area allows more algae growth and also beneficial bacteria. This gives the tadpole an additional food source as well as increased natural filtration in the water.
The larger water volume also reduces the chances of the water fouling. While with some species I think there maybe a benefit to the algae growth Im not sure all would see the benefit or the same benefit.
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I have also noted that tadpoles will more readily eat the algae growth on the side of the container, than introduced (dried) algae.
This could be a sign that the algae you are feeding they may not care for. Have you tried different mixes or brands?
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This movement of the water has some effects:
1. Removal of old or stagnant water.
2. Removal or dispersal of growth inhibiting pheromones given of by siblings.
3. Increasing the water/oxygen level, due to increased exposure of water to the air.
Water movement can be is easiest to achieve when using a small filter or the outlet from a filter.
Water movement maybe beneficial, but frequent water changes may also be enough. Weekly or twice a week...
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By increasing the feeding of a varied diet for the tadpoles, will naturally also increase the rate of pollution of the water in the tadpole rearing containers.
This will require increased water changes or water filtration.
This maybe your best helper as I personally do not believe that the algae based diets are enough.
I personally believe that a mixture of foods like you have stated is the best method, but I am not sure we have an exact understanding of what foods or foods mixtures will be ideal for each species of frog. I personally use frogbites and from time to time mix with dried brine shrimp or sera micron. Other than that I have not had any issues, since leaving the standard algae mixes.
I tend towards tanks that tend to take care of themselves, and rarely change water, but rather add water as it evaporates. By having tanks with sand substrates, usually floating plants for filtration, maybe undergravel as well, correct tadpole populations (don't eat ALL the food in the tank in a short time, but a handful that constantly graze), grazing food sources and numorous feedings, I've kept water changes low.
Feedings with prepared foods were done with food they ate within 15 minutes, before the prepared foods would spoil and foul the water (tropical fish flakes, betta flakes, betta pellets, livebearer flakes, and tadpole bites). Due to low light conditions, algae was not common in these tanks, but there was a nice bacterial slime over everything, which all tadpoles loved to graze on, and were given rocks to graze, as well as tadpoles injesting the sand and passing it later (also observed at the ABG with hylid tads and why I changed from gravel to sand).
In epipedobates especially, dead leaves serve a duel purpose. They can be surfaces for bacteria to grow, but for me observation of wild tadpoles in the tropics, per. comm. with other breeders, and personal experience is that the leaves are actually a food source them selves. Boiled oak and almond leaves, like those used to make tadpole tea, are softened and readily eaten, espeically by epipedobates. Anubias leaves are a grazing ground when the leaf is alive, but readily eaten when the leaf dies. During my stay in Costa Rica a shallow depression full of hylid tadpoles would attack fallen dead leaves like piranha, stripping the leaves down to the major veins.
Unfortunately, I can really only talk with experience with epipedobates tricolor/anthonyi, as I usually let my other frogs take care of their tadpoles by themselves, and they eat a lot of tank sludge
Corey, could you elaborate on this? Are you saying that it is good for a tad to ingest sand?
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but there was a nice bacterial slime over everything, which all tadpoles loved to graze on, and were given rocks to graze, as well as tadpoles injesting the sand and passing it later (also observed at the ABG with hylid tads and why I changed from gravel to sand).
Ben Eiben actually showed pics here on DB way back when of a hylid tadpole with very clearly sand in the intestines. basic idea is that the sand particale had a layer of bacteria growing over the surface of it, and the tadpole ingested the whole grain of sand, and "digested" the layer of bacteria, and passed the non-digestible sand. In the case of tadpoles where all there really is in their pond is silt, they probibly ingest the silt to get the bacteria layer. This seemed to be the case of the hylid tadpoles I saw in the wild, as well as when Ben was describing. I haven't checked any PDF tadpoles that were in sand bottomed ponds for that, but I'll have to check it out in the future if I am so lucky.
This could be a sign that the algae you are feeding they may not care for. Have you tried different mixes or brands?
I ahve tried several different type and combinations if dried foods, but the result is always the same. When presented with with fresh and dried algae, the tadpoles choose the fresh over the dried. This is not to say that they do not eat the dried food, they will eat fresh first.
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Originally Posted by kyle1745
This maybe your best helper as I personally do not believe that the algae based diets are enough.
I agree with you 100% on not relying on solely an algae based diet. Tadpoles that I have raised on a good mixed diet have always morphed out looking a lot heathier than those raised on a algae only diet.
As these were observation notes, I did mention that the more varied the diet the closer you have to monitor the water quality.
I agree with Corey that some species' tadpoles do thrive better when provided with a mulch on "which" to graze. This mulch layer is host to a number of micro organisms on which the tadpoles can feed.
I may not have the experience to contribute, but raising 20 Imitator tads all the same way on tadbites and a mix of chloro/spirol/fish food, i have had great success with only 2 water changes in the span that they morph out. i put in a dried magnolia leaf for cover and let the slime and algea take over, only to add water when evaporation requires it. i raise them in a dish about 5" in diameter and a 1 1/4" deep. they seem to love the algea and slime that takes over in the 14wks they are in it. they all come out different sizes of course, depending on the tad. but all very healthy and feed well after out of water. i have always worried about saying anything outloud about my lack of water changes, because everyone always harps on how important it is, but i figured in the wild they dont always have clean conditions and seem to have always thrived on slime and algea. So thats my experience with my successes, haven't lost one yet. oh, and i only feed every 3 days.
Ben Eiben actually showed pics here on DB way back when of a hylid tadpole with very clearly sand in the intestines. basic idea is that the sand particale had a layer of bacteria growing over the surface of it, and the tadpole ingested the whole grain of sand, and "digested" the layer of bacteria, and passed the non-digestible sand. In the case of tadpoles where all there really is in their pond is silt, they probibly ingest the silt to get the bacteria layer. This seemed to be the case of the hylid tadpoles I saw in the wild, as well as when Ben was describing. I haven't checked any PDF tadpoles that were in sand bottomed ponds for that, but I'll have to check it out in the future if I am so lucky.
I thought it was clay...or am I thinking of another post?
wow, 14 weeks for imitator tads to morph? what temps are you keeping them at? mine used to come out closer to 7-8 weeks out of the egg.
do you guys who dont feed fish foods check ammonia levels in your containers? does the bacteria actually keep the nitrate and nitrite levels down too? ive been keeping some tads in clear pen pals and have noticed they dont eat very much fish food when i feed them. it seems to sit on the bottom but the tads are growin like weeds in those setups. i still do a partial water change and take out the bottom waste w/ a turkey baster once a week or two weeks.
Ben used a clay native to the Atlanta area in his compst tank, is that what you were thinking of?
Tadpoles that have foods to graze on may be less aggressive come feeding time, or you may be feeding too much. My tadpoles always went after the red fish flakes pretty aggressively once they recognized it as food. The communal tanks I had set up had no water quality problems, but smaller singluar containers might, tho i rarely checked their water. Overflowing the single tad containers occassionally helped as well to "change" some of the water... remember these containers may be flooded almost every day during the rainy season keeping these nutrients from building up. I over flowed the individual containers once a week. Then I got lazy and just let mom and dad do the work (but still made sure to "flush" the containers/broms used at least once a week).
Observations on Tadpole Growth "Warning Long Post"
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